Monaco's succession issues

[sirhon11234]

I've said it on other forums and I'll say it again. I think Albert is going to need Alex some day. He should be careful how he treats both of his children. If Nicole does what she should do I feel that Alex will grow up well. His causins have not been raised properly. I hope Stephanie raises her children well.

There are times when fathers have to fall back on the children that they ignored.

How very true Bahamagirl.

 

[Henri M.]

It is not that easy for Prince Albert to change the constitition.

In name a 'Sovereign state', Monaco in reality is a protectorate of France. Monaco can do nothing without omnipresent and mighty France, also not changing the succession.

France namely will annexate Monaco when the Prince has no legitimate heirs. This means that, behind the screens, France is watching closely by.

 

[Bahamagirl]

Let us not forget that Alex is a bonified French citizen.

 

[smdouglas]

It is not that easy for Prince Albert to change the constitition.

In name a 'Sovereign state', Monaco in reality is a protectorate of France. Monaco can do nothing without omnipresent and mighty France, also not changing the succession.

France namely will annexate Monaco when the Prince has no legitimate heirs. This means that, behind the screens, France is watching closely by.

I agree that the constitution is not easy to change (nor should it be).

Your other facts are incorrect (i.e., sovereign state and no legitimate heirs). I'll let you do the research.

 

[BurberryBrit]

Oh please!!
Talking about PA adopting Alex when he doesn't even want to see him or to be a part of his childhood/upbringing (except for money) is totaly ridiculous and out of question!IMO

Oh, do you have access to his day planner? Can you verify that his only link to his child is via a monthly bank deposit? My opinion is no more ridiculous than your opinions so please watch your tone as I don't think those kind of posts are allowed.

It is not that easy for Prince Albert to change the constitition.

In name a 'Sovereign state', Monaco in reality is a protectorate of France. Monaco can do nothing without omnipresent and mighty France, also not changing the succession.

France namely will annexate Monaco when the Prince has no legitimate heirs. This means that, behind the screens, France is watching closely by.

And maybe it should.

I've said it on other forums and I'll say it again. I think Albert is going to need Alex some day. He should be careful how he treats both of his children. If Nicole does what she should do I feel that Alex will grow up well. His causins have not been raised properly. I hope Stephanie raises her children well.

There are times when fathers have to fall back on the children that they ignored.

Yes, I've experienced this. But for some reason, people would rather pretend he doesn't exist? If I was a Monegasque, the idea of Andrea and Tatiana representing the state would terrify me. A 3 year old child can be raised properly. We may think Albert doesn't like Alex because of his disdain for Nicole, but he may surprise us.

 

[royal pauper]

Let us not forget that Alex is a bonified French citizen.

Well then he can run for a French president. I am sure French would love it! They are more open minded then Monegsque.

The question is, do the people want Andrea?

Alex is a child and still has time to be groomed (which I don't think Andrea has been). That's my main reason for him going ahead and adopting him. Perhaps he still thinks he will marry and that's why he hasn't made any step towards the succession issue.

They say if you really, really want something and keep dreaming about it, it could come through. Keep dreaming!
I know Monaco and Monegasque better then you think. It will never happen.

 

[BurberryBrit]

Well then he can run for a French president. I am sure French would love it! They are more open minded then Monegsque.


They say if you really, really want something and keep dreaming about it, it could come through. Keep dreaming!
I know Monaco and Monegasque better then you think. It will never happen.

What are you talking about? What do you really have against an innocent child?

 

[royal pauper]

What are you talking about? What do you really have against an innocent child?

Absolutely nothing!
I would like to know how you can tell or see from the picture that Andrea, Pierre and Charlotte are not intelligent/smart enough to rule Monaco and Alex (three year old boy) is bursting with smarts and intelligence. It must be something Alex said or did that made such an impression on you. I would like to know what is that? Just curious!
There are at least five eligible heirs as of today to rule after PA.
Also, I don't think we should be worrying about that for at least 20/30 maybe even 40 years.

 

[Lakshmi]

I agree we cannot say that Andrea will be bad ruler of Monaco. We don't know a lot about Casiraghi siblings. And Andrea is still very young...
I heard/read somewhere that young prince Rainer did have reputation of playboy and nobody expected him to be a great ruler back then.

 

[Bahamagirl]

If he ever were to become interested in Politics and run and actually win an election in France, now would'nt that be something when he has to meet with dad from Monaco.

 

[WindsorIII]

I agree we cannot say that Andrea will be bad ruler of Monaco. We don't know a lot about Casiraghi siblings. And Andrea is still very young...
I heard/read somewhere that young prince Rainer did have reputation of playboy and nobody expected him to be a great ruler back then.

Very true. Prince Rainier rose to the occassion after taking over at the young age of 26. I don't think anyone is ever really "ready" for the takeover. Training for it and preparing for it are nothing compared to the realities that fall on the person when that day actually comes.

Andrea could surprise like Rainier did and be a great ruler. I think its a moot point right now as I don't see Prince Albert abdicating any time soon.

 

[hibou]

If he ever were to become interested in Politics and run and actually win an election in France, now would'nt that be something when he has to meet with dad from Monaco.

Actually, in the "old days" not all illegit. kids were hidden or tossed aside, many rulers brought them up at court and then if they were smart and talented sent them off as ambassadors to other countries. They were brought up to be grateful for the wealth given and opportunites which would hopefully bring loyalty to the legit heir and help protect him not to mention if an ambassador was killed it was no threat to the existence of the monarchy of that country.

Conidering that Monaco is bound to France in many ways, wouldn't that be a huge advantage for Monaco to have Alex in public office in France?

 

[Lakshmi]

Little Alexandre is just 3 y.o. and there are already so many great plans for him. Maybe we should let him finish preschool first.

 

[shappica]

I would like to know how you can tell or see from the picture that Andrea, Pierre and Charlotte are not intelligent/smart enough to rule Monaco and Alex (three year old boy) is bursting with smarts and intelligence. It must be something Alex said or did that made such an impression on you. I would like to know what is that? Just curious!

That's exactly what I'm thinking reading this thread!
How can you tell anything about Casiraghis based only on pictures. Only thing we see is that they love to party, and why shouldn't they , they're in early twenties. Everybody gets serious at the point in life when they really have to.

 

[coco]

You are right shappica.

Think of Caroline. When she was young she loved to party like her children do. But nowadays she would be a great ruler, I think.

I would like to see Andrea on the throne, one day . . .

 

[brother]

Everybody gets serious at the point in life when they really have to.

it depends how late in life that happens. it's hard to change old habits (look at uncle albert).

 

[shappica]

it depends how late in life that happens. it's hard to change old habits (look at uncle albert).

Good point, so if he can rule, anybody can (including Andrea)!

@ #316- I also think that Caroline would be great ruler!

 

[RachelD]

Isn't Andrea next in line to the throne after his Uncle? I thought I'd read or heard somewhere that he'd been officially entered or registered as such. Provided there are no direct heirs from Albert. Direct as in he marries and has children, not illegitimate children.

 

[coco]

Isn't Andrea next in line to the throne after his Uncle? I thought I'd read or heard somewhere that he'd been officially entered or registered as such. Provided there are no direct heirs from Albert. Direct as in he marries and has children, not illegitimate children.

No I think he is next after Caroline. Then comes Pierre and then Chalotte, Alexandra, Stephanie, Louis, Pauline. I'm not quite sure about Camille, I think she isn't in the line because her father wasn't married with Stephanie . . . . I think it's the same system in Great Britain.

 

[RachelD]

Ohhhhh.....ok. Thanks Coco for explaining!

 

[anag]

No I think he is next after Caroline. Then comes Pierre and then Chalotte, Alexandra, Stephanie, Louis, Pauline. I'm not quite sure about Camille, I think she isn't in the line because her father wasn't married with Stephanie . . . . I think it's the same system in Great Britain.

I don't believe that Stephanie was married when she had Louis (so he wasn't in line), but then she later married Daniel and then Louis became legitimate.

Ani

 

[coco]

I don't believe that Stephanie was married when she had Louis (so he wasn't in line), but then she later married Daniel and then Louis became legitimate.

Ani

oh, you're right, she married Daniel later. But that means that if she married Camille's father, Camille would become legitimate . . . that's strange.

 

[anag]

oh, you're right, she married Daniel later. But that means that if she married Camille's father, Camille would become legitimate . . . that's strange.

I know, I thought it was strange too. But he is 7th in line despite his illegitimacy at birth. I don't know, it was probably a clause in the old constitution (which allowed illegitimate children to take the throne), but then Prince Rainier changed it in 2003 (I believe to prevent Alex, and I guess Jazmin, from ruling).

Ani

 

[Grace]

I've just seen the tv show about the Principality Albert and Stephanie took part in at the beginning of June, and talking about the Casiraghi Albert said they are studying abroad, one in Milan, one in Paris and one in New York, human studies, law and economy, and he added "ils se prepairent", they are training, getting ready...I don't know if he meant for ruling, but it certainly sounded like that.

 

[hibou]

I've just seen the tv show about the Principality Albert and Stephanie took part in at the beginning of June, and talking about the Casiraghi Albert said they are studying abroad, one in Milan, one in Paris and one in New York, human studies, law and economy, and he added "ils se prepairent", they are training, getting ready...I don't know if he meant for ruling, but it certainly sounded like that.

Hi Grace can you recall his phrasing before and after your quote as Albert can be very clever with his words and imply things that aren't necessarily there. If he said they are in training it would be great if you can recall what he said immediately after that because it might be there that you find his true meaning. It could be true and perhaps the reason why Caroline was not there, so she would not have to answer questions like that. I am just guessing of course. But if you can recall anything it would help us in the interpretation. Thanks!

 

[Grace]

Steph was talking about his kids and how she did her best to shed them from the spotlight, so Albert added Caroline is a great mom as well; the interviewer asked about her kids and whether it was true they study abroad and Albert said what we already know: Andrea in NY, Pierre in Milan and Char in Paris, then added they study humanistic studies, law and economics (without specifying who takes which subject, but they are all very close to "government studies" if you know what I mean; not like archtecture or engeneering), and closed saying that phrase "Ils se prepairent" without specifying for what: for life, for their future jobs? I found it a little ambiguous, even if he probably meant nothing by it, but I got the impression he meant for Monaco, in whatever capacity...I think after that phrase they changed subject.

 

[hibou]

Steph was talking about his kids and how she did her best to shed them from the spotlight, so Albert added Caroline is a great mom as well; the interviewer asked about her kids and whether it was true they study abroad and Albert said what we already know: Andrea in NY, Pierre in Milan and Char in Paris, then added they study humanistic studies, law and economics (without specifying who takes which subject, but they are all very close to "government studies" if you know what I mean; not like archtecture or engeneering), and closed saying that phrase "Ils se prepairent" without specifying for what: for life, for their future jobs? I found it a little ambiguous, even if he probably meant nothing by it, but I got the impression he meant for Monaco, in whatever capacity...I think after that phrase they changed subject.

Thanks Grace, That's typical of Albert to give a vague answer. He may have ment for the good of Monaco but not necessarily in preparation to take the throne. His cousins Melanie deMassey (sp) is already employed in Monaco I can't remember exactly in what capacity. Paca would probably be able to tell us. So I think he just ment to help Monaco.

 

[olga101]

succession

Little Alexandre is just 3 y.o. and there are already so many great plans for him. Maybe we should let him finish preschool first.

Agreed Lakshmi. And perhaps Prince Albert does have plans for Alexandre, as was said once, in some capacity when he becomes a teenager.

IMHO, it would really really be stretching it to think that child as adult would ever come into power there. There are so many others and, maybe with some possible other royal fathers of their out of wedlock children might consider changing or whatever. But for this royalty regarding that child, not likely. There's so much bad feelings, etch connected to and with him.

We can always hope time will clear that up-but hope is just that-hope.

 

[kimebear]

HSH vs HRH

Does anyone know if it is intended that if HRH Princess Caroline ascends the throne after Albert, would her children be styled with her courtesy HRH or would they retain the legitimate HSH? I believe this was the way the Luxembourg royals elevated themselves from HSH to HRH.

 

[libra65]

Does anyone know if it is intended that if HRH Princess Caroline ascends the throne after Albert, would her children be styled with her courtesy HRH or would they retain the legitimate HSH? I believe this was the way the Luxembourg royals elevated themselves from HSH to HRH.

I would guess they would be HSH. Her HRH is only thru Ernst. Her older children wouldn't be in line for that, only Alexandra would.