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  #881  
Old 02-28-2012, 02:58 PM
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I wanted to say that many people seem to be looking at the term rehabilitation center and taking that as a good sign, and there are times when it can be.
However, I would like to point out that most people who are terminally ill or in a vegitative state are sent to a rehabilitation center as opposed to being kept in hospitals. At least in the US. hospitals are used only for short term care, maybe a few weeks. Otherwise you are sent to a "rehabilitation center" where there is around the clock care and are set up for long term care.
I do think that it is a title that is misleading and wish they would come up with some other way to describe places where it's more about long term care and less about "rehabing" people.
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  #882  
Old 02-28-2012, 03:35 PM
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Originally Posted by Kellydofc View Post
I wanted to say that many people seem to be looking at the term rehabilitation center and taking that as a good sign, and there are times when it can be.
However, I would like to point out that most people who are terminally ill or in a vegitative state are sent to a rehabilitation center as opposed to being kept in hospitals. At least in the US. hospitals are used only for short term care, maybe a few weeks. Otherwise you are sent to a "rehabilitation center" where there is around the clock care and are set up for long term care.
I do think that it is a title that is misleading and wish they would come up with some other way to describe places where it's more about long term care and less about "rehabing" people.
I agree with you. Rehab could include moving the patient to avoid bedsores, etc. It's not necessarily working with the patient to regain speech, etc.
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  #883  
Old 02-28-2012, 04:05 PM
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Originally Posted by Emmily View Post
I agree with you. Rehab could include moving the patient to avoid bedsores, etc. It's not necessarily working with the patient to regain speech, etc.
Although it is very true that for many in this situation, a rehabilitation center is mainly for long term care, at this point in time nothing is for certain. To quote the statement released "The doctors cannot guarantee that the Prince will awaken from his coma, or give a timeframe as to when this could be expected. If he does wake up, his rehabilitation will take months or years." We simply do not know what is going to happen down the line.

Either way, as it has been suggested that there is an excellent clinic in London, he'll be in the best of care whatever the outcome is to be in the future. We can only watch, hope and pray along with the DRF. My heart goes out to the family.
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  #884  
Old 02-28-2012, 07:12 PM
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Originally Posted by COUNTESS View Post
Dr. Eynon is just speculating here, as he has not been consulted and has no personal knowledge of the event. The DRF has been given information that we are not privy to. Many physicians will be interviewed to give their views. That is not to say that they are incorrect, but may have no basis in fact for this case. Unless you have seen the patient and seen all the material pertinent to that patient, you are speculating.
This post applies just as well to those who think that he should be allowed to die. I (and others) have pointed out that we do not have all the facts, and that, unlike the family who are with him every day, have no real information about his condition. Personally, I'd rather err on the side of keeping my loved one alive until they do have a good handle on what may happen than letting him die when maybe he would have lived and recovered if I hadn't been so quick to decide that I should let the person die.
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  #885  
Old 02-28-2012, 09:10 PM
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I discovered many years ago, when my first husband died, never say what you would do, until you are, actually, faced with the situation. How you think you would react may not be the case, until it is real. The DRF are facing a "real" situation. I do not have any idea what their thoughts or instincts are. But, I know, whatever they do, will be the right thing for them and for Friso.
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  #886  
Old 02-28-2012, 09:43 PM
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Originally Posted by COUNTESS View Post
I discovered many years ago, when my first husband died, never say what you would do, until you are, actually, faced with the situation. How you think you would react may not be the case, until it is real. The DRF are facing a "real" situation. I do not have any idea what their thoughts or instincts are. But, I know, whatever they do, will be the right thing for them and for Friso.

True,I agree.One doesn't know untill one is faced with the situation,everything else is not opportune.People are known to stumble over themselves to reverse previous decisions,meanings,opinions,untill,until when it really mattered.

And on the nursing home,they might call it anything ,even rehab,but that doesn't mean at all what some like to read from it,we all would like to read from it if it wasn't that this specific situation isn't one with any,any,improvement.People on full life-support,as is the case,are not to stay in hospitals simply because these places are no nursing homes so one just occupies a bed intended for other purposes,like Kellydofc already explained,it's the same here.

And,no decision is made yet where the Prince will move too,nor the country as many claim to have the best care in the field,so does my country.What would matter is absolute discretion here.I know for a fact press calls nursing homes and inquires on their coma wards in relation to a possible stay of Friso.They're trying their tricks of the trade for a scoop.
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  #887  
Old 02-28-2012, 09:52 PM
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How sad, Lucien. In a difficult time, you need space to think and no flashbulbs in your face. And, yes, hospitals here and, I see in your nation, do not let patients stay, so the euphemism for nursing home has become rehab.
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  #888  
Old 02-28-2012, 10:15 PM
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At the point I don't think anyone really knows what going to happen next week or next month. The doctors probably don't even know which is why they are neutral on the subject. Sometimes the outcome isn't known for weeks or possibly months.

My mother went in a coma after suffering a stroke. She was able to breathe on her own but gradually her body shut down over a 4 day period. About 12 hours before she died, tests were done on her to see if what her neurological responses would be. Until these tests were done, my brother and I had hope that she would come out of the coma.

At first the doctor offered some hope as she was breathing on her own and her heart was beating normally. It was difficult to watch as they had to bend her arms and legs for the tests. They tapped her hands, arms, legs and feet. They also opened her eyes and flashed light in their eyes. They also asked her to squeeze their hand if she could hear them.

There was no response to anything that I saw and I watched very closely and the doctor confirmed this and he left the room shortly thereafter not saying anything. It was very sad. I knew at that point that my mom wouldn't recover and so did my brother. She most likely would be in a comatose state until she passed.

She had a Do not resuscitate order. We were told that at most she might have lived an hour or two if that if they tried to revive her. Had I not witnessed the neurological testing they did on my mom, I might have some guilt over this.

When a family is in this type of situation (family member in coma), they will know what is the right thing for them or their family member to do. Every situation is different and there is no right or wrong answer.
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  #889  
Old 02-29-2012, 12:01 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kataryn View Post
Have a look at this video to get a feeling what skiing in "champagne powder" is about in Austria.
Thanks for the lovely video(ruined by rap music, which I hate with a passion) and also for all the great info you provided.

It looks so graceful, powerful and easy to ski at the level of skill in that video but of course it isn't.
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  #890  
Old 02-29-2012, 02:04 AM
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Originally Posted by lucien View Post
T
And,no decision is made yet where the Prince will move too,nor the country as many claim to have the best care in the field,so does my country.What would matter is absolute discretion here.I know for a fact press calls nursing homes and inquires on their coma wards in relation to a possible stay of Friso.They're trying their tricks of the trade for a scoop.
What the family at the moment needs most is time. And there is no need to bring Friso out of the hospital as long as the family can pay for the bed - the season is not yet over but the amount of tourists is slowly getting smaller and such is the need for the hospital beds - plus there a some clinics in a short flying distance from Innsbruck which offer similar intensive care, so I don't think the family will get any pressure to remove the prince before they found the right place.

And then they simply need time to absord what has happened and to come to terms with their situation. This surely is not a short time thing but will slowly evolve over time. The media interest will die down, some decisions need to be made, including the question how often one wants to visit the patient or how much intrusion in everyday life can or will one allow this situation. That's hard, but that's how it is.

It's like being diagnosed with cancer - in the beginning everything has to be speedy, speedy, but once the diagnosis is there, the first OP survived, all facts on the table -it is time to take time to decide on the right treatment which might take years, might not be successful in the end but is necessary and cannot be avoided. In this case not the patient is in this situation, but his family, but still there will be decisions to be made for him, for the others of the family and these decisions will have to be adopted to the developments of the situation.

So everything will slowly evolve and when the time is come to make a final decisions, all concerned hopefully feel similarily or can at least understand the other's way to think and decide.
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  #891  
Old 02-29-2012, 11:06 AM
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Where is Mabel now? In Innsbruck or in London or in the netherlands?
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  #892  
Old 02-29-2012, 12:05 PM
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I read today from a finnish evening paper, Iltasanomat, that Martti Ahtisaari, the former president of Finland is deeply shocked about prince Friso´s accident. Prince Friso is his friend, says Riikka Marjamäki, the head of the office of president Ahtisaari.
President Ahtisaari has known princess Mabel for many years and they are very close. President Ahtisaari is a member of the group Elders, princess Mabel is the Chief Executive Officer of the group. Riikka Marjamäki tells that Ahtisaari has known Mabel at least for ten years. Ahtisaari appreciates princess Mabel very much because she is an exceptionally talented woman. Ahtisaari may have met prince Friso at a state visit, but they have become friends because of Mabel. Prince Friso and princess Mabel attended at the dinner when president Ahtisaari was awarded with the Nobel Peace Prize. Riikka Marjamäki tells that president Ahtisaari and the people in his office are waiting for more news like the rest of us.
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  #893  
Old 02-29-2012, 07:11 PM
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Champagne powder

Dear Kataryn -- thank you very much for the video, I've never been skiing or understood the attraction of it but that really did look beautiful.

And thank you also for the explanation of how the piste differed from off-piste. I had been figuring an avalanche could hit anywhere on the slope, and that the piste was simply a marked ski area with trees cleared away. I did not realize the snow would actually be different.

It's hard to get angry at Prince Friso; I grant you, this was somewhat risky, but if he'd gone down the slope two or three minutes earlier, the avalanche would probably not have caught him. A few minutes later, and he would not have started down the slope. Also he had his friend with him who had even more familiarity with skiing in these mountains and was willing to go out anyway.
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  #894  
Old 02-29-2012, 08:19 PM
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It's possible they caused the avalanche themselves - that's one reason why they declare certain areas out of bounds. That same weekend, something like 4 people died in avalanches here in the Western U.S., and in each case, the investigators are talking about how light powder, on top of frozen snow and ice, is a recipe for avalanche - and the people who run the slopes try to keep people off those areas. But, apparently, they are very exciting to ski upon.

As the people ski down, they dislodge this lightweight powder which creates forces both up and down the slope, and the snow can move so fast - it seems light at first glance and is apparently just the most amazing snow to ski on.

His friend had an avalanche bag (sort of like an airbag for a car) so the two of them may have approached this trip rather differently. When people get excited, they don't always use the same judgment as when dealing with more sober activities.

But in both Hawaii and California, we sometimes call this the "Sonny Bono" effect, because as people age, their reactions/reflexes to fast-moving events slows down and they just don't realize it - especially if it's not a daily activity. They think they can ski/surf/jetski the way they used to, and that they can get themselves out of situations that once they may actually have been able to outrun or avoid. There's a reason it's so often middle aged men who get into these accidents (I think all of the ones here in the Western U.S. were middle aged men that weekend). But, a young woman died in Grand Canyon last week on a risky adventure (off trail - something she'd done before but did not survive this time). So it isn't always middle-aged men.

I do know that some of us are much more comfortable with risk and that kind of excitement than others and it was part of his personality, part of what made Prince Friso who he was, so no, we cannot fault him. Accidents happen (and they seem to happen more frequently so many people doing more activities...)
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  #895  
Old 02-29-2012, 09:57 PM
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One never knows when something will happen. People die in accidents they never had forseen. Life is a gamble. He was an expert. I don't think he thought of this outcome. It is very sad.
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  #896  
Old 03-01-2012, 12:19 AM
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Has there been an official statement as to whether this accident was caused by negligence of the skiers? When I first heard about this I remembered the incident with Prince Charles, where he and his party ignored signs that were posted throughout the area.
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  #897  
Old 03-01-2012, 01:33 AM
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Originally Posted by XeniaCasaraghi View Post
Has there been an official statement as to whether this accident was caused by negligence of the skiers? When I first heard about this I remembered the incident with Prince Charles, where he and his party ignored signs that were posted throughout the area.
The investigation is still ongoing. There has been a first report but AFAIK they only said they needed more time and further questionings and expert Statements.

@ AnnieCat -thank you for your interest!
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  #898  
Old 03-01-2012, 08:54 AM
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German and Austrian papers today report that the queen will leave Austria on the weekend to return to The Hague and that there are rumours that Friso will be flown by ambulance jet to a clinic in London with Mabel and the children following. "Well-informed circles" claim that the transport will even happen today.

http://diepresse.com/home/leben/mens...leben/index.do

In this article it is claimed that the State's Broadcasting Company of Austria (ORF) reported he was already flown out of Austria this morning, but where he was flown to is still unknown. He reportedly was brought in an ambulance, followed by a convoy of other cars, to Innsbruck airport where he was loaded on board an ambulance plane and flown out of Austria.

http://www.kleinezeitung.at/nachrich...nende-ab.story
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  #899  
Old 03-01-2012, 09:53 AM
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Prince Friso is on his way to London. The family already arrived this morning.

Fan van Máxima » Breaking: Prins Friso bedolven onder lawine in Lech (9)

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  #900  
Old 03-01-2012, 10:54 AM
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Thank you to everyone who is keeping us informed. I check this thread often for new news. Such a tragic and sad situation for all involved. I wish the best for Prince Friso, his family, the DRF and all those who hold Prince Friso dear.
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