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  #641  
Old 02-24-2012, 01:27 PM
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Originally Posted by maria-olivia View Post
HM Queen Beatrix knew this terrible news since the beginning. When I saw her going for the first time seeing her Son all was written on her face.
Yes, seing Beatrix leaving the hospital had the same effect on me.

My father had a stroke 7 years ago, he cannot speak, understand language, read, write or even gesture, the part of the brain that enables us to do so is simply destroyed. He also is wheelchair bound and cannot move his right side. This sounds terrible, and coming to terms with this was and is a hole in the soul of veryone involved. But - he is still with us, and his character is intact. He still loves watching sport, listen to music and sitting in the sun.

It brings tears to my eyes that Prince Friso cannot even have that and that his daugthers cannot have what I still have, a father who recognises them and is happy to see them. That is not fair.

If he would have died, there would be closure now, time to heal. So they are in a in-between-world. From my experience in the first 6 weeks after my fathers stroke, when he was not dead but also not really alive, it is a terrible place to be.
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  #642  
Old 02-24-2012, 01:31 PM
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What a pity that we can't turn back time! To last week friday morning and warn the prince!
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  #643  
Old 02-24-2012, 01:38 PM
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There's a saying that hindsight is always 20/20. Just think of all the would-haves, should-haves, could-haves in our lives and how we would have done things differently if we could go back and correct the errors of our past.
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  #644  
Old 02-24-2012, 01:59 PM
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Originally Posted by Meraude View Post
Unfortunately when it comes to brain damage there are slim to no chances that new discoveries in the medical field will make it possible to recreate the memories (and in essence who a person is) when the cells in the brain where those memories are stored are destroyed. The body may go on living, but what makes a person unique is gone and lost.
Yeah, but life is life; there are a lot of families that love their family members, brain damaged or not. The brain is still a mystery and I am sure that it's something tht can be dealt with in time. I just hope he lives and can live without a machine.
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  #645  
Old 02-24-2012, 02:01 PM
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Just woke up and saw the news on my facebook feed. I'm devastated. I'll keep the whole family in my thoughts and prayers. I do hope he does recover.
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  #646  
Old 02-24-2012, 02:13 PM
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Originally Posted by MissJanet View Post
Yes, seing Beatrix leaving the hospital had the same effect on me.

My father had a stroke 7 years ago, he cannot speak, understand language, read, write or even gesture, the part of the brain that enables us to do so is simply destroyed. He also is wheelchair bound and cannot move his right side. This sounds terrible, and coming to terms with this was and is a hole in the soul of veryone involved. But - he is still with us, and his character is intact. He still loves watching sport, listen to music and sitting in the sun.

It brings tears to my eyes that Prince Friso cannot even have that and that his daugthers cannot have what I still have, a father who recognises them and is happy to see them. That is not fair.

If he would have died, there would be closure now, time to heal. So they are in a in-between-world. From my experience in the first 6 weeks after my fathers stroke, when he was not dead but also not really alive, it is a terrible place to be.
I do not recall seeing Queen Beatrix so upset since the funeral of Prince Claus. Her burden is immense, because not only does she have her own sorrow to deal with, she is a mother to her two other sons, mothin-in-law to dear Mabel and grandmother to the little girls. It is a comfort to know that the royal family are so close and will be source of support and strength to eachother.

Thank you for sharing your story about your father (and to others who have shared their stories). It has made me feel very emotional tonight hearing it all. It is wonderful to know that your father still enjoys sport, music and sitting in the sun. Above all, he will surely know that you all love him - for being loved is the most important feeling to have.

My hopes and prayers continue for Friso and all his family.
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  #647  
Old 02-24-2012, 02:18 PM
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Originally Posted by MarNoe View Post
Maybe someone with medical knowledge can answer this. Why, when they are fully aware of the devastating effects of lack of oxygen to the brain for prolonged periods, did the medical staff at the hospital spend so long in resuscitation(sp?) attempts.
Here in the US, in the absence of a Do Not Recussitate Order, signed by the patient or their legal proxy, the medical staff will continue to try to Recussitate, no matter how poor the likely outcome.
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  #648  
Old 02-24-2012, 02:23 PM
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Originally Posted by AnnieCat View Post
Also, doctors really, really hate having to tell any family, no matter what their social standing, "hey, we are sorry but we had to give up on your loved one." For their own peace of mind, they need to be able to say, and feel, that they did everything they could.
For me this is always the crux of the issue in resuscitations. Many times resuscitations are unsuccessful - you work as hard as you can and do everything you're supposed to, and the patient still dies. Deciding when to end a resuscitation can be complex but one thing I always keep in the back of my mind is that, if this doesn't work I'm going to have to go speak to the person's family, who are often waiting just down the hall, and tell them their loved one has died. With someone as young as Friso the family group will often include the person's parents. For my own good, yes, but also I believe for the family's good, I need to be able to tell them, honestly and unequivocally, that there was nothing else the resuscitation team could have done.

I'd also like to point out that, to me, it doesn't seem that Friso was treated any different, or any more aggressively, than any other patient in his situation would have been. Fifty minutes is not an abnormally long period of time to resuscitate someone in hospital, especially a young, previously healthy person. And once they got him to the ICU he would have been treated like every other patient, according to the standard of care.
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  #649  
Old 02-24-2012, 02:36 PM
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Yeah, but life is life; there are a lot of families that love their family members, brain damaged or not. The brain is still a mystery and I am sure that it's something tht can be dealt with in time. I just hope he lives and can live without a machine.
Yes, life is life - but one has to consider quality of life. I know I would NEVER want to be kept alive by machines, and even if there was a slim chance of waking up, being a burden on everyone would, to me, be the ultimate hell.
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  #650  
Old 02-24-2012, 02:42 PM
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Yes, life is life - but one has to consider quality of life. I know I would NEVER want to be kept alive by machines, and even if there was a slim chance of waking up, being a burden on everyone would, to me, be the ultimate hell.
100% in agreement. Undoubtably it is a decision, with the best of medical advice, that Prince Friso's family will have to face at some time.
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  #651  
Old 02-24-2012, 02:50 PM
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Quote:
Dutch Prince Johan Friso may never regain consciousness
Dutch Prince Johan Friso may never regain consciousness after ski accident - hellomagazine.com
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  #652  
Old 02-24-2012, 02:57 PM
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It just occurred to me that Prince Friso probably has some sort of medical directive/living will that outlines what his wishes would be for life support in just such a situation. I have one, and I'm just an ordinary American citizen; I imagine that in his position, both as a royal and as an executive of a corporation, such contingencies were considered. I hope so, as it would alleviate some of the burden of decision making at a time like this. Either way, my prayers are with his entire family...it's such a sad, sad time for all of them.
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  #653  
Old 02-24-2012, 03:01 PM
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Originally Posted by MARG View Post
So because the paparazzi are such vultures he should send all the children away? You have got to be joking. Taking them to the spot where media are following . . . . excuse me, this is not all about the rights of the media, it is not even about Prince WA "knowing better". It is about family!

The family are where they are because of tragic personal circumstances and like most families, when the going gets tough the family get together to support each other and to protect each other. In families this works both ways. The adults protect the children and try to maintain as much normality as they can. The children provide their parents and extended family with joy, and a belief in the future. They are balm to the lacerated spirits of the adults who understand the severity of the situation.

Are the children of the NRF not entitled to be with their family in such dire circumstances? Are they to be kept out of sight, perhaps even shunted off home without their parents, knowing that a loved parent or uncle could yet die, maybe sent back to school which I am sure the media would stake out with impunity.

So, it is the media that is intruding on a family's pain, grief and distress. Just because Friso is a Prince does not negate common decency with respect to his family.
My point isn't whether it's right or wrong. I'm saying it's inevitable that the media will be following a story like this aggressively, whether the prince likes it or not. If he wants to spare the children from this intrusion, he shouldn't bring them into the middle of it.

I'm not saying that's fair or humane or anything else. But it is a fact.
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  #654  
Old 02-24-2012, 03:02 PM
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What an unholy mess and what a disaster. I hope his family does keep him alive, even if he is in a coma or vegetative state, the thing is that he should at least take a year or two of rehabilitation and then see how things go. And then, only then, should there be any possibility of 'letting go.' A lot of people don't always initially show any affect and time si the best indicator of what will happen.
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  #655  
Old 02-24-2012, 03:05 PM
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I have been following the news of Prince Friso's accident since earlier this week and I was initially cautiously optimistic that he would not only survive but walk out of that hospital to cheers. Surely he can afford the best of care and medicine and technology have improved so much. The longer the wait went on, though, and seeing the heartbreaking photographs of Mabel and Beatrix and the rest of the family, you just knew that the situation was grave. Still, it was a real shock to come online today and read the words: massive brain damage, may never wake up, resuscitation for 50 minutes. Really shocking for me, and I only knew the man through pictures and message boards. I just cannot imagine the grief felt by his family, and sadly which will continue to be felt. Of course you never wish death for somebody but what kind of life is in store for him now. On the other hand, I imagine if it were one of my loved ones, I would want to hold on for as long as possible. As someone else said, what if there is still a chance for improvement in his condition? 50/50 odds? Even with 10/90 or less, there is still some hope, always some hope. I'm not a religious or spiritual person, but I want to send Friso & his family all of the positive energy I have in the hopes that whatever the result ends up being, it brings peace and healing
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  #656  
Old 02-24-2012, 03:07 PM
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I'm sure before they decide to do anything, they'll be consulting with a battery of specialists for their opinions. However, the objective is not to lose sight of what is merciful and better for Friso in the end.
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  #657  
Old 02-24-2012, 03:08 PM
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Originally Posted by crm2317 View Post
I agree that being left in a vegetative state seems worse than being allowed to die. I wonder if he is breathing on his own or if he is being kept alive by life support machines. If he is being kept alive by the machines then the family may decide to switch them off.
I was thinking yesterday this might be why Queen Beatrix is returning to the Netherlands this weekend to meet with the Prime Minister. Although removing life support would obviously be a personal, family decision, I suppose it could have political ramifications.

(It probably would here in the United States, but I don't know if it would in the Netherlands.)
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  #658  
Old 02-24-2012, 03:08 PM
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, even if he is in a coma or vegetative state, the thing is that he should at least take a year or two of rehabilitation and then see how things go.
For me that seems incredibly cruel for him and for his family. JMO, but certainly not something I would want for myself.
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  #659  
Old 02-24-2012, 03:11 PM
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I don't see how it would have any political ramification since Friso gave up his rights to the throne on his marriage. I'm sure at this point whatever decision is made rests in the hands of his family.
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  #660  
Old 02-24-2012, 03:12 PM
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I was thinking about what the family might do about moving Prince Friso to rehab, and it made me wonder what they did about care for Queen Juliana or Prince Claus during their long declines. Did they set up a "home hospital" for either of them or did they go to institutions for treatment?

Prince Friso would probably need very specialized care, so even with all the family's resources, it might not be preferable, but who knows?
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