The Royal Forums Coat of Arms


Join The Royal Forums Today
Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
 
  #1  
Old 06-12-2012, 10:13 PM
Newbie
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: Dallas, United States
Posts: 1
Would Elizabeth have become Queen anyway?

QE II is Queen because her father, George VI, was King and died; she was the oldest of only two daughters. So, if her Uncle, Edward VIII, say he never had abdicated and whether or not he ever married, but also never had any children, wouldn't QE II still have eventually become Queen? Let's assume Edward VIII died while he was King without any children. Wouldn't George VI have still become King? Then, wouldn't Elizabeth still have become Queen? All this of course would have presumably happened many years later. And it would also have assumed that George VI hadn't died before Edward VIII. In that case, I would guess that the crown would have gone to one of their brothers - Prince Henry, William or John and then to one of their children.
__________________

Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 06-12-2012, 10:21 PM
HRHHermione's Avatar
Heir Presumptive
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Boston, United States
Posts: 2,306
No, it would have gone to Elizabeth anyway. She was third in line at birth behind her father and Edward VIII. But, as Edward was young, it was assumed that he would have children which would have made it unlikely that Elizabeth would ever ascend the throne.
__________________

Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 06-12-2012, 10:56 PM
Serene Highness
 
Join Date: May 2012
Location: Washington, United States
Posts: 1,119
Interesting question dpjgen. Of course, Edward the VIII never had any children, so if he had been allowed to marry Wallis Simpson and remain King, Elizabeth would have eventually ascended the throne, although not until 1972, when Edward died.
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 06-12-2012, 11:42 PM
Nobility
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Location: Top End, Australia
Posts: 424
Quote:
Originally Posted by dpjgen View Post
QE II is Queen because her father, George VI, was King and died; she was the oldest of only two daughters. So, if her Uncle, Edward VIII, say he never had abdicated and whether or not he ever married, but also never had any children, wouldn't QE II still have eventually become Queen? Let's assume Edward VIII died while he was King without any children. Wouldn't George VI have still become King? Then, wouldn't Elizabeth still have become Queen? All this of course would have presumably happened many years later. And it would also have assumed that George VI hadn't died before Edward VIII. In that case, I would guess that the crown would have gone to one of their brothers - Prince Henry, William or John and then to one of their children.

If Edward had not abdicated but the Queen's father had died before him the crown would still have passed to Elizabeth when Edward died. It would never have gone to one of the King's younger brothers because Elizabeth was always higher than them in the order of succession.
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 06-13-2012, 01:18 AM
Jacknch's Avatar
Super Moderator
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Suffolk, United Kingdom
Posts: 3,107
It's a question I've often pondered over the years.
Imagine that if Edward had been allowed to marry Wallis Simpson, they still never had children, Bertie had still died before Edward and Edward still died in 1972, Queen Elizabeth II would have been celebrating her Ruby Jubilee - 40 years - and not her Diamond Jubilee! Maybe a double celebration with Queen Margrethe II!!
__________________
JACK
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 06-13-2012, 03:05 AM
fandesacs2003's Avatar
Heir Apparent
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Athens, Greece
Posts: 3,454
On December 27th, into the thread about Duc and Duchess of Windsor, I had post a similar question about QEII and I received some very interesting explanations. It is post no 1003 and onwars.
Have a look, if i posted correctly.
Duke and Duchess of Windsor (1894-1972) and (1895-1986)
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 06-13-2012, 03:19 AM
Lumutqueen's Avatar
Imperial Majesty
Royal Blogger
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Carlton, York, United Kingdom
Posts: 17,541
Elizabeth would have become Queen and potentially her father a King, if Edward never had any children. Simple.
__________________
We Will Remember Them.
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 06-15-2012, 08:49 PM
RoyalistRiley's Avatar
Courtier
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Brisbane, Australia
Posts: 507
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jacknch View Post
It's a question I've often pondered over the years.
Imagine that if Edward had been allowed to marry Wallis Simpson, they still never had children, Bertie had still died before Edward and Edward still died in 1972, Queen Elizabeth II would have been celebrating her Ruby Jubilee - 40 years - and not her Diamond Jubilee! Maybe a double celebration with Queen Margrethe II!!
I wonder if George VI would have lived a much longer life if he didn't have to face the strains of war as King and had a decent (for lack of a better word) post 1945? Elizabeth II may have been like Prince Charles in this alternate history - waiting for something (accession to the throne) that may or may not come.
__________________
God Save the Queen! Advance Australia Fair!
"Life is a game in which the player must appear ridiculous" - The Dowager Countess of Grantham, Downton Abbey
http://twitter.com/FutureSirRiley
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 06-19-2012, 12:19 AM
Heir Presumptive
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: katonah, United States
Posts: 2,585
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lumutqueen View Post
Elizabeth would have become Queen and potentially her father a King, if Edward never had any children. Simple.
I have read in a few books, that at the time of the abdication a deal was struck re: David having a vasectomy (who knows if it's true). Had he remained on the throne, assuming normal sexual function and fertility, he might have had children. Perhaps not by Wallis, but fate has proven itself capricious. What if Wallis had died, for example in a car wreck in Paris, and David remarried? Perhaps the second wife would have had a child. In that case, it would be the heir. If not, certainly we would stil have QEII.
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 06-19-2012, 12:28 AM
HRHHermione's Avatar
Heir Presumptive
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Boston, United States
Posts: 2,306
Quote:
Originally Posted by scooter View Post
I have read in a few books, that at the time of the abdication a deal was struck re: David having a vasectomy (who knows if it's true). Had he remained on the throne, assuming normal sexual function and fertility, he might have had children. Perhaps not by Wallis, but fate has proven itself capricious. What if Wallis had died, for example in a car wreck in Paris, and David remarried? Perhaps the second wife would have had a child. In that case, it would be the heir. If not, certainly we would stil have QEII.
One the abdication was complete, David and his children were out of the line of succession entirely. Any child he had would never have replaced Elizabeth as the heir.
Reply With Quote
  #11  
Old 06-19-2012, 01:16 AM
auntie's Avatar
Royal Highness
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Middlesex, United Kingdom
Posts: 1,504
Even if Edward viii would have ascended the throne and Wallis become queen consort, In the case that they wouldn't have had children EII would have reigned, but it would have been a different monarchy, the jewels would have been plundered, the private assets completely depleted, and the nation wouldnt have had respect for the whole institution
Reply With Quote
  #12  
Old 06-19-2012, 01:41 AM
Jacknch's Avatar
Super Moderator
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Suffolk, United Kingdom
Posts: 3,107
Quote:
Originally Posted by auntie View Post
Even if Edward viii would have ascended the throne and Wallis become queen consort, In the case that they wouldn't have had children EII would have reigned, but it would have been a different monarchy, the jewels would have been plundered, the private assets completely depleted, and the nation wouldnt have had respect for the whole institution
I agree, it would have been a different monarchy and the issue of the jewels and private assets is an interesting one! It would certainly have been a different royal family and one wonders how it would all have turned out - would Elizabeth still have married Philip and would they still have had four children with the ten year gap between the second and third children?
Elizabeth would still have been a wonderful queen, but there is something about the fact that she came to the throne an apparently vulnerable/quite shy young woman who has now reigned for decades but who was at the beginning thrown in at the deep end on the sudden death of her father. Would the circumstances of coming to the throne later in life have changed her style of reigning I wonder?
__________________
JACK
Reply With Quote
  #13  
Old 06-19-2012, 08:37 AM
Heir Apparent
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Toronto (ON) & London (UK), Canada
Posts: 5,287
As for the jewels, would Queen Mary have left anything to Queen Wallis or would she have bypassed her and left the bulks of her jewels to the Duchess of York and her eldest daughter?
Reply With Quote
  #14  
Old 06-19-2012, 09:21 AM
MichelleQ2's Avatar
Courtier
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Los Angeles, United States
Posts: 847
Quote:
Originally Posted by NGalitzine
As for the jewels, would Queen Mary have left anything to Queen Wallis or would she have bypassed her and left the bulks of her jewels to the Duchess of York and her eldest daughter?
I wonder how much of Mary leaving the jewels to QE2 was the tax laws whereby the sovereign is exempt from paying inheritance tax
Reply With Quote
  #15  
Old 06-19-2012, 09:51 AM
Duke of Marmalade's Avatar
Majesty
TRF Author
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Frankfurt am Main, Germany
Posts: 9,619
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lumutqueen View Post
Elizabeth would have become Queen and potentially her father a King, if Edward never had any children. Simple.
Quite a likely scenario, one of the things that I cant really imagine is Wallis as a mother.
Reply With Quote
  #16  
Old 06-19-2012, 10:09 AM
auntie's Avatar
Royal Highness
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Middlesex, United Kingdom
Posts: 1,504
Quote:
Originally Posted by NGalitzine View Post
As for the jewels, would Queen Mary have left anything to Queen Wallis or would she have bypassed her and left the bulks of her jewels to the Duchess of York and her eldest daughter?
George V did pass a law that any presents received by the monarch or consort during their reign belonged to the state and could not go to anyone else, thus preventing major peices from getting lost along the line (Kokoshnik tiara comes to mind) b/c of a favorite daughter. As of private pieces, Queen Mary could have bequeathed it in her lifetime. But haveing Princess Lilian of Belgium on mind, she did sell major pieces, perhaps to spite the fact that her children were not part of the succesion. I do recall reading that Edward VIII was so desperate to keep the throne and Wallis, he suggested that maybe if Parliament was in agreement, he would marry her, she would never be crowned queen, and any children would never succeed, parliament (and maybe Wallis) never agreed
__________________

Reply With Quote
Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off





Popular Tags
australia best outfit birth camilla chris o'neill crown prince frederik crown prince haakon crown princess mary crown princess mette-marit crown princess victoria current events death duchess of cornwall duke of cambridge fashion fashion poll france funeral germany hereditary grand duchess stéphanie infanta leonor king abdullah of jordan king felipe king felipe vi king harald king philippe king willem-alexander letizia maxima official visit picture of the week president gauck president hollande prince carl philip prince charles prince daniel prince of wales princess ariane princess beatrice princess charlene princess madeleine princess marie princess mary princess mary style princess mette-marit princess victoria queen elizabeth ii queen fabiola queen letizia queen letizia daytime fashion queen letizia fashion queen letizia style queen mathilde queen maxima queen maxima fashion queen maxima style queen rania queen silvia queen sonja royal fashion sayn sofia hellqvist spanish royals state visit sweden the hague tiara victoria wedding willem-alexander


Our Communities

Our communities encompass many different hobbies and interests, but each one is built on friendly, intelligent membership.

» More about our Communities

Automotive Communities

Our Automotive communities encompass many different makes and models. From U.S. domestics to European Saloons.

» More about our Automotive Communities

Marine Communities

Our Marine websites focus on Cruising and Sailing Vessels, including forums and the largest cruising Wiki project on the web today.

» More about our Marine Communities


Copyright 2002-2012 Social Knowledge, LLC All Rights Reserved.

All times are GMT -4. The time now is 10:54 PM.

Social Knowledge Networks

eXTReMe Tracker
Powered by vBulletin
Copyright ©2000 - 2015
Jelsoft Enterprises

Royal News Delivered to your Email!

You can get the latest Royal News right in your inbox.

unsusbcribe at anytime with one click

Close [X]