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  #21  
Old 07-17-2015, 09:08 PM
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what utter garbage. They why publish them at all. They might as well say " i know these are libelous , we claim they aren't , we are going to publish them anyhow seeing as how we paying through that teeth for them, but we know they are libelous".

If it didn't affect they then why publish it at all. What total/utter trash
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  #22  
Old 07-17-2015, 09:10 PM
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I still think the story is who had it I assume the Queens father took the video was it sent to relatives in Germany was it in an old cupboard
Where was it ?who had it ?


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  #23  
Old 07-17-2015, 11:14 PM
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Originally Posted by royal rob View Post
But the Queen Mother was doing it and laughing also I thought she didn't like Edward or was that only later. I'm surprised that it wasn't burnt long ago


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I think the distance came after the affair with Wallis started, which was 1934, so after the video was shot.
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  #24  
Old 07-17-2015, 11:19 PM
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The Queen is blameless. She was just a child but goes to show we dodged a bullet with Edward VIII
Dodging a bullet implies luck. As far as Edward VIII is concerned though, I doubt it was just a lucky coincidence. My impression is that the British government was fully aware that he was a Nazi sympathizer and that must have played a major part in the abdication ( with Mrs. Simpson of course providing a convenient excuse).
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  #25  
Old 07-18-2015, 12:22 AM
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If you watch the full clip on YouTube it's the Queen mother that's starts it so it isn't uncle Edward teaching them but would still love to know who had it


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  #26  
Old 07-18-2015, 12:24 AM
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This whole thing is so disconcerting, as others have pointed out. For one thing, how did the Sun obtain this video, and why is it being made public now? Someone must have known about it or held onto it.

Also, the Sun obviously knows what they're stirring up, and knows the video will be taken out of context. Of course, people today are going to view the Nazis from a post-War perspective, because that's only natural. However, many won't stop to think that things would obviously have been perceived differently before the war. My grandmother was in high school in the United States in the 1930s, and in her German classes, one of the things they learned was the German national anthem. Now, that's not an unusual thing to learn in a language class, but the version of the anthem that they were taught became so strongly associated with the Nazis that it was no longer used after the war. To this day, my grandmother still remembers all the words to the version of the anthem that she learned (she didn't know that it had been changed until, at some point, she met some German people and tried to impress them with her knowledge of the their national anthem, and they were rather horrified and embarrassed to hear the Nazi version!), and it was a bit surprising to me to learn that my grandmother had been taught that in a U.S. public school. However, once I remembered that she had attended high school before the war, it made sense. They were just learning about contemporary Germany, which at the time was governed by the Nazis.

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Originally Posted by sndral View Post
I think the distance came after the affair with Wallis started, which was 1934, so after the video was shot.
Yes, If I recall, the Queen Mother was rather fond of Edward VIII until Wallis came along.
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  #27  
Old 07-18-2015, 12:39 AM
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Originally Posted by royal rob View Post
If you watch the full clip on YouTube it's the Queen mother that's starts it so it isn't uncle Edward teaching them but would still love to know who had it


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The Queen Mother had no Fascist leanings though, unlike Edward, who was an anti-Semite to boot. He was still calling Jewish people 'yids' and other offensive epithets AFTER the war, as Rex Harrison's then wife (herself Jewish) recalled.

We don't know what was happening on the Balmoral lawn before the camera rolled. Hitler's mannerisms and the Nazi salute were regarded as amusing in 1933, and the Queen Mother or Edward may have started imitating it and roaring with laughter. The QM is seen laughing in the film.

In my own family a great-uncle (who had served in WWI) used to do a great imitation of Hitler working himself up into a rage when making a speech. The other adults in the family thought it was hilarious. It was his party turn in the early 1930's (in Britain.)
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  #28  
Old 07-18-2015, 01:55 AM
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Will the Sun be made to say how they got it ? Did it really just fall into their lap.
I'm just waiting for the other shoes to fall. I have a horrible feeling there is more to come.
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  #29  
Old 07-18-2015, 02:39 AM
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The film clip, as I understand it, was made before Hitler even assumed power. They couldn't possibly have known what Nazism would evolve into at the time.
To them it would have been just another fascist movement, like so many others in Europe at the time. Whether they at the time had sympathies for the fascists/Nazis is anyone's guess. After all on the surface fascism represented a kind of disciplined order with conservative values. I think the Communists would have worried the BRF more at the time.

Anyway, if people are to get heat for stupid and/or tasteless jokes and goofing around within what is supposed to be the safety of a family circle, we'd all be in trouble! (I sure would).

The only one who is blameless in all this is QEII.
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  #30  
Old 07-18-2015, 02:47 AM
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Of course the 2 children are blameless. The Adults maybe not
It depends who got the movie and why


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  #31  
Old 07-18-2015, 02:59 AM
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General News & Information for Queen Elizabeth and Duke of Edinburgh

They are saying clip was made in1933 before Hitler got power but Hitler did gain control in 1933 and started removing Jewish business etc. unless I have my dates wrong they would have known what sort of man he was. Didn't the book burning happen in 1933


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  #32  
Old 07-18-2015, 03:22 AM
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Hitler came to power in February 1933. However the great bulk of anti Jewish legislation wasn't enacted until 1935 (the Nuremberg Laws.) Its my understanding that this film clip comes from some time in 1933.

Hindsight is a wonderful thing isn't it? The book burnings of May 1933 were probably regarded as 'those nasty Germans/Huns behaving in a nutty way again!' Remember, it was then only fifteen years since the end of the war and there was still animosity in Britain towards Germany and the Germans.

Of course Hitler and many Germans of the time were anti-Semitic and it certainly would not have been comfortable to have been a Jew in Germany in 1933.

However, it's worth noting (according to Shawcross, the QM's biographer) that the Queen Mother's old governess, a German Kathe Kubler, who had taught her before World War One, wrote to her in April 1933 protesting that the British Press were prejudiced against Herr Hitler and had quite the wrong idea about him. (She was later dismissed from her post as headmistress of a big girls school after, according to the QM, they found out she was Jewish.)
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  #33  
Old 07-18-2015, 03:29 AM
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Germany 1933 is interesting reading on history pages. For the (then) future king of England not to have known what happen to non-Aryan's during that time is not believable. But as we know the world turned a blind eye. Sorry for my many postings


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  #34  
Old 07-18-2015, 03:33 AM
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Originally Posted by Curryong View Post
Hitler came to power in February 1933. However the great bulk of anti Jewish legislation wasn't enacted until 1935 (the Nuremberg Laws.) Its my understanding that this film clip comes from some time in 1933.



Of course Hitler and many Germans of the time were anti-Semitic and it certainly would not have been comfortable to have been a Jew in Germany in 1933.



However, it's worth noting (according to Shawcross, the QM's biographer) that the Queen Mother's old governess, a German Kathe Kubler, who had taught her before World War One, wrote to her in April 1933 protesting that the British Press were prejudiced against Herr Hitler and had quite the wrong idea about him. (She was later dismissed from her post as headmistress of a big girls school after, according to the QM, they found out she was Jewish.)

Yes it would not have been "comfortable " to be a Jew and have your business closed even if for just a day and not allowed to follow some of your rituals


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  #35  
Old 07-18-2015, 03:40 AM
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No, royal rob, it is, as you say, all very interesting, and sheds a light once more on a horrible period of European history.

However, I don't think you can blame Britain or the BRF (even Edward) for what was going on in Germany after Hitler came to power. The British were still traumatised by four years of war and the loss of nearly a million men (including a brother of Elizabeth's) and so preferred to regard Hitler and the Nazis as at first, figures of fun and then increasing irritations, until it was almost too late.
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  #36  
Old 07-18-2015, 04:05 AM
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This looks bad now but remember it was 1933 and years before the war even started. No one had any idea what was coming.

As the Palace stated, the time and context are important.

Yes agree unfortunately no one had idea what was coming. And obviously for the Queen it is a game she is only 7 years old.
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  #37  
Old 07-18-2015, 04:10 AM
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I think they may have been learning to do the highland fling. The hand and arm positions look more like that than a heil salute. And they were in Scotland....
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  #38  
Old 07-18-2015, 04:10 AM
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Dodging a bullet implies luck. As far as Edward VIII is concerned though, I doubt it was just a lucky coincidence. My impression is that the British government was fully aware that he was a Nazi sympathizer and that must have played a major part in the abdication ( with Mrs. Simpson of course providing a convenient excuse).
I agree.I believe the most importand reason fot the abdication was the Nazis and not the Wallis Simpson but of course the helped and that too.
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  #39  
Old 07-18-2015, 04:43 AM
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No, royal rob, it is, as you say, all very interesting, and sheds a light once more on a horrible period of European history.

However, I don't think you can blame Britain or the BRF (even Edward) for what was going on in Germany after Hitler came to power. The British were still traumatised by four years of war and the loss of nearly a million men (including a brother of Elizabeth's) and so preferred to regard Hitler and the Nazis as at first, figures of fun and then increasing irritations, until it was almost too late.
You are right, Curryong.

If anyone back in 1933 would have suggested the idea that the Nazis should, let alone would, commit industrialized genocide the vast majority, even among the Nazis, would consider it half-mad ramblings.

Mussolini was no doubt the most well known fascist leader at the time and many in Britain, also within the BRF, would no doubt consider him a somewhat comical figure rather than a serious danger.

But there were fascist movements all over Europe (and Japan) at the time. Even though the majority of these movements were still of minor importance.
And there were several authoritarian regimes in Europe at the time as well, not to mention the Soviet Union.
The idea of a "strong leader" wasn't as unpalatable then as it is now.

That the Nazis back then were anti-Semitic was hardly headline news! Jews were persecuted with more or less enthusiasm outside Germany as well, in other countries they were barely tolerated. So in the eyes of outsiders the Nazis were just another movement blaming the Jews for everything.
Even supposedly well-informed and well educated people at the time had a wrong impression of the fascist movements. While at the same time, and that is important, they were scared of the Communists.

Another thing is that racism was not politically incorrect at the time. In fact it was taught in schools and shown in movie-documentaries. That includes racism towards Jews.

If this movie had been made in 1953 then there would be just cause for condemnation. But I can't blame people back in 1933 for not being able to see into the future.
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  #40  
Old 07-18-2015, 04:58 AM
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My great grandfather was an editor and lawyer; my greatgrandmother was jewish - they left germany in August 1933 as it became clear to my family, that it was no longer a country to live in with jewish origins. (I know that so precisly because I own some furniture still with custom-stamps on them from August 1933).

However I can very well see, that 'Herr Hitler' and that hideous ' 'Nazi-Gruss' was a thing one made fun of - like Charly Chaplin did - and many others too. If one sees film-footage of that time, it is too bizaar for words how they behaved. Of course the world made fun of them! It took some time to see, that they wherent just vile clowns. Now we have ISIS - in the 30th and 40th the world had the Nazis... then there where the Red Khmer and Idi Amin - and some more vile crazy murderous

I cannot understand that not more is done to get ISIS out of the world. The only diffrence with ISIS is not yet in Europe ...
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