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  #161  
Old 12-17-2015, 02:03 AM
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I get the feeling that it's generally accepted that a republic is what the Barbadians want.

In 1994 the Barbados Labour Party made it clear that a republic was one of their aims. They won the election and in 1996 they had a Constitution Review Commission which after 2 years recommended the formation of a republic. A referendum bill was introduced in 2000, but dropped during the 2003 election. It was then reintroduced in 2005, with a plan for a 2008 referendum, but that got dropped (the government focused instead on CARICOM). I feel that it should be added that during all this time the same party was in power, being re-elected twice; and one of the main issues in the 2003 election was abolishing the monarchy.

The BLP lost the 2008 election, bringing in the Democratic Labour Party. It's this party that is currently in power (and had been since 2008, with a 2013 re-election) and is pushing the issue again. So basically the two major parties in Barbados support a republic.

I don't think it's a coup or un-democratic. Perhaps not the best way to do it, but if the issue has been on the table for more than 20 years and has consistently been sidelined by other issues I can understand the desire to skip what would be a costly and time consuming referendum that ultimately wouldn't actually do anything as the change would have to be issued on a vote in the House of Assembly in the end anyways.
1 - It's not a coup, but it is very un-democratic.

2 - If a referendum is held on the monarchy and the Barbadians votes to keep it, Barbados will remain a monarchy. Yes, it will be costly, but democratic.

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Given the difficulty with changing the constitution in Canada and the fact that the provincial and federal governments seem to never all be on the same page, I wouldn't expect a Canadian Republic any time soon. Too much hassle without enough support.
Yes, I know.

What I meant was if the monarchy was abolished in these modern democratic countries (Canada, Australia and New zealand), it had only happened after a referendum. People would have demanded it, regardless of what the constitution requires or not.
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  #162  
Old 12-17-2015, 02:06 AM
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If the Constitution says that the law can be changed with a vote in parliament then that is all that is needed.


The fact that for around 20 years this has been on the agenda but hasn't happened suggests that the political parties are working towards passing the law when there is a clear majority without having to waste the money on a referendum.


If the people of Barbados have been electing parties that support that idea for the last two decades it suggests very strongly that there is a broad base of support.


Is there a party that supports keeping the monarchy? If not then that too would suggest that there is broad support for a republic.
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  #163  
Old 12-17-2015, 03:17 AM
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Barbados is a two party system. Both parties favour a republic.

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Originally Posted by ROYAL NORWAY View Post
1 - It's not a coup, but it is very un-democratic.

2 - If a referendum is held on the monarchy and the Barbadians votes to keep it, Barbados will remain a monarchy. Yes, it will be costly, but democratic.

If a key component of an election campaign is creating a republic and that party gets voted in, it's safe to assume that the people support a republic.

If both major parties in a country support the creation of a republic, particularly if the country tends to be regarded as fairly democratic and without corruption (Barbados tied the US for the 17th least corrupt country in the world, 2014, on the Transparency Index), then it's safe to assume that that's in line with what the people want.

Both cases are true in Barbados. This may not be the best way to go about it, but the government - not fringe groups, not even the opposition, the party holding the majority of the seats in the House of Assembly - has been working towards a republic for 20 years now. That's despite the fact that both of the major parties have formed governments in that time period.

It would be like if a Democrat in the US ran for president on an issue, was elected, spent two terms working towards that issue (including having a Commission say that yes, the American people were behind said issue), then his successor ran on the same issue and was elected, dropped the issue to focus on other things and lost his re-election to the Republican candidate who said that he was going to focus on that issue and agreed with the Democrats that it should be done.

A referendum, while appearing more democratic, at this point would really just confirm what 20 years of Babados' political history has established, waste time and tax payer money, and potentially drop the issue again, when even after a referendum they would still have to have two-thirds of the House of Assembly vote to pass a change to the constitution.
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  #164  
Old 12-17-2015, 05:35 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Iluvbertie View Post
If the Constitution says that the law can be changed with a vote in parliament then that is all that is needed.


The fact that for around 20 years this has been on the agenda but hasn't happened suggests that the political parties are working towards passing the law when there is a clear majority without having to waste the money on a referendum.


If the people of Barbados have been electing parties that support that idea for the last two decades it suggests very strongly that there is a broad base of support.

.
Not necessarily. General elections are fought around many issues and the fact that a republican party wins them doesn't directly imply that there is a republican majority among voters. The only way to know that for sure is to have a single-issue vote, i.e a Yes/No referendum specifically on keeping or abolishing the monarchy, preceded by a campaign period where each side can put its case to the electorate.

It may be the case that, if a referendum is held, the republic will win with a comfortable majority, but taking the decision to fundamentally change the way Barbados' head of State is chosen without consulting the people and without giving the monarchists a chance to be heard would be fundamentally wrong and undemocratic.
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  #165  
Old 12-17-2015, 06:32 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ish View Post
If a key component of an election campaign is creating a republic and that party gets voted in, it's safe to assume that the people support a republic.

If both major parties in a country support the creation of a republic, particularly if the country tends to be regarded as fairly democratic and without corruption (Barbados tied the US for the 17th least corrupt country in the world, 2014, on the Transparency Index), then it's safe to assume that that's in line with what the people want.

Both cases are true in Barbados. This may not be the best way to go about it, but the government - not fringe groups, not even the opposition, the party holding the majority of the seats in the House of Assembly - has been working towards a republic for 20 years now. That's despite the fact that both of the major parties have formed governments in that time period.

It would be like if a Democrat in the US ran for president on an issue, was elected, spent two terms working towards that issue (including having a Commission say that yes, the American people were behind said issue), then his successor ran on the same issue and was elected, dropped the issue to focus on other things and lost his re-election to the Republican candidate who said that he was going to focus on that issue and agreed with the Democrats that it should be done.

A referendum, while appearing more democratic, at this point would really just confirm what 20 years of Babados' political history has established, waste time and tax payer money, and potentially drop the issue again, when even after a referendum they would still have to have two-thirds of the House of Assembly vote to pass a change to the constitution.
You obviously know what you're talking about and I often agree with you, but not in this.

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Originally Posted by Mbruno View Post
It may be the case that, if a referendum is held, the republic will win with a comfortable majority, but taking the decision to fundamentally change the way Barbados' head of State is chosen without consulting the people and without giving the monarchists a chance to be heard would be fundamentally wrong and undemocratic.
You're absolutely right when it comes to this, to abolish the monarchy without consulting the people and without giving the monarchists a chance to be heard is (as you say) fundamentally wrong and undemocratic.
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  #166  
Old 12-17-2015, 09:37 AM
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I agree with both of you. I am a strong constitutional monarchist and a strong believer in democracy so I think it is the people of Barbados who should decide this through a referendum and not the government/parliament, but I must admit that I find it odd that a country shall have a foreigner as head of state.

In modern democracies such as Canada, Australia and New zealand it will be held referendums (if the politicians agrees about it), but that is not the case with the Caribbean countries who are full of corrupt politicians.

It's odd but sad at the same time thinking about this.
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  #167  
Old 12-20-2015, 04:28 PM
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Not necessarily. General elections are fought around many issues and the fact that a republican party wins them doesn't directly imply that there is a republican majority among voters. The only way to know that for sure is to have a single-issue vote, i.e a Yes/No referendum specifically on keeping or abolishing the monarchy, preceded by a campaign period where each side can put its case to the electorate.

I agree; it's telling that the issue has been tabled for so long because other things were deemed more important.

I think a referendum should be held, since that would make it clear how the majority feels.

(They may feel monarchy is out of date, as many do. Perhaps they should take a look at the last state banquet; does anyone truly think that the Chinese president would be just as happy dining at 10 Downing Street instead of Buckingham Palace?)
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  #168  
Old 03-01-2016, 02:09 AM
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New Zealand poet to perform for the Queen | Stuff.co.nz
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  #169  
Old 03-06-2016, 02:21 AM
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http://gpdhome.typepad.com/royalblog...-at-least.html

Long To reign over us:Queen Elizabeth keeps Jamaica and Barbados (for now at least)
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  #170  
Old 03-06-2016, 05:42 AM
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Even if temporary this is very good news! The Queen garners such respect from leaders all over the Commonwealth.
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  #171  
Old 03-14-2016, 04:16 AM
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Queen Urges Inclusivity In Commonwealth Message
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The Queen has urged people to support "those in need" and others who "feel excluded" in her annual message to mark Commonwealth Day.

She said helping those less fortunate would be a way of embodying this year's Commonwealth theme of inclusivity.

The Queen's message will form part of the annual Commonwealth Day service at Westminster Abbey being held this afternoon.

In her message, the Queen, who is head of the Commonwealth, wrote: "Today, and in the year ahead, the theme An Inclusive Commonwealth is an inspiration for us all.

"Let us give it practical effect by supporting those in need and those who feel excluded in all walks of life. By doing so, we will continue to build a truly representative Commonwealth community."

The Queen also said working together for the common good was an essential ingredient of belonging to the family of nations.

"Each of us has cause to celebrate the sense of belonging expressed in our 2016 theme: An Inclusive Commonwealth," she wrote.

"Our recognition of this value, and the wisdom of mutual respect for each other, is set out in the Commonwealth Charter. Its opening words, 'We the people of the Commonwealth' convey the conviction that individuals, as well as governments, build and shape our success.

"Being inclusive and accepting diversity goes far deeper than accepting differences at face value and being tolerant.

"True celebration of the dignity of each person, and the value of their uniqueness and contribution, involves reaching out, recognising and embracing their individual identity."
Beautifully said by our beloved Monarch.
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  #172  
Old 03-14-2016, 08:35 AM
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http://gpdhome.typepad.com/royalblog...-at-least.html

Long To reign over us:Queen Elizabeth keeps Jamaica and Barbados (for now at least)

What is happening in Jamaica and Barbados is a common pattern among Commonwealth realms, specifically:

1) Changing the Head of State is not a priority and makes little difference in people's daily lives.

2) The republican movement cannot agree on a model for the Head of State who would replace the Queen (e.g. ceremonial president versus executive president).

3) The constitutional hurdle to abolish the monarchy is very high and normally difficult to overcome.

4) There is a great deal of respect for QEII personally and, due to her seniority, there is reluctance to propose any change while she is still on the throne.
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  #173  
Old 03-14-2016, 04:23 PM
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Commonwealth Day: Queen calls for inclusiveness - BBC News
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Mr Annan told the congregation: "Today the Commonwealth stands as a confident, modern, multicultural and proudly inclusive organisation."

He said the Queen had shown "unwavering and steadfast devotion" to the Commonwealth, adding: "We are greatly honoured and deeply grateful for your extraordinary commitment to its people."
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  #174  
Old 03-17-2016, 04:34 AM
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Queen Elizabeth and the Duke of Edinburgh attended a reception for the High Commissioners' Banquet to mark Commonwealth Week at the Guildhall on March 16:



** gettyimages/zimbio gallery: The Queen and the Duke of Edinburgh Attend a Reception for the High Commissioners' Banquet **
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  #175  
Old 03-17-2016, 05:03 AM
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.

Queen Elizabeth and the Duke of Edinburgh attended a reception for the High Commissioners' Banquet to mark Commonwealth Week at the Guildhall on March 16:



** gettyimages/zimbio gallery: The Queen and the Duke of Edinburgh Attend a Reception for the High Commissioners' Banquet **

Pictures And Photos | Getty Images
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  #176  
Old 03-17-2016, 05:08 AM
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The Queen attends a reception for the High Commissioners' Banquet at the Guildhall in central London this evening, in her role as Head of the Commonwealth. Her Majesty is accompanied by the Duke of Edinburgh Prince Phillip, and receives a presentation from the Lord Mayor on behalf of the City of London Corporation.

Home - ITNSource News
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  #177  
Old 03-17-2016, 05:47 AM
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City of London Corporation dedicates ancient woodland to the Queen | London | News | London Evening Standard
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  #178  
Old 03-17-2016, 09:30 AM
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Originally Posted by ROYAL NORWAY View Post
Video:
The Queen attends a reception for the High Commissioners' Banquet at the Guildhall in central London this evening, in her role as Head of the Commonwealth. Her Majesty is accompanied by the Duke of Edinburgh Prince Phillip, and receives a presentation from the Lord Mayor on behalf of the City of London Corporation.

Home - ITNSource News
I like how The Queen chuckled when she had a problem getting up from her chair at 2:56.
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  #179  
Old 03-24-2016, 05:58 AM
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Not sure whether this should go here, but New Zealanders have voted in a referendum to retain their present flag.

New Zealand votes to keep its flag in referendum | World news | The Guardian
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  #180  
Old 03-24-2016, 12:02 PM
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Excellent news, a demonstration that assumptions should not be made about the will of the people.
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