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  #501  
Old 01-28-2015, 07:30 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CrownPrincessJava View Post

Unlike the US, we vote for a party to govern.

We actually don't vote for a party at all. We vote for individuals who tell us what party they are affiliated with.

Remember that many, many times politicians here have changed their party but have kept their seats - in both Houses - as we elect individuals.

It is a common misconception that we vote for parties because that is what most people look at but the reality is it is the person we elect and if that person decides to change their party they remain as our representative until the next election anyway. If we voted for a party then when that happens the person would have to give up their seat to someone from the same party but they don't.
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  #502  
Old 01-28-2015, 08:03 PM
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There are far more important things in this world than Prince Philip honorary knighthood. I don't see how this effects your day to day life in anyway. At lot of countries have knighthoods even some republics have them. Load of fuss over nothing.
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  #503  
Old 01-28-2015, 08:26 PM
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Originally Posted by royalistbert View Post
There are far more important things in this world than Prince Philip honorary knighthood. I don't see how this effects your day to day life in anyway. At lot of countries have knighthoods even some republics have them. Load of fuss over nothing.
I find it amusing that so many people who are not Australian are telling us that we are making a mountain out of a molehill.

Well this issue has marked another turning point for me. When I joined this board I was a monarchist but being part of discussions here forced me to examine my feelings on the subject and I became a republican. However I still wanted to retain the flag and not change it, but after this fiasco I am rethinking that, too, and I am not so sure I want the Union Jack on my national flag. The Eureka Flag is looking better and better to me.
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  #504  
Old 01-28-2015, 08:35 PM
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I very much agree with the reinstatement of Knights and Dames and I don't see the terms as an expression of subservience to Britain.
British history is shared history.
The titles Knight and Dame are well known and have been used for many years in Australia. I identify them with people who deserve an extra accolade for their achievements. They are more easily used and more easily identify a person who has earned the title on their own merit. There is an impressive list of Australians who have been called Sir and Dame.
Dame Nellie Melba, Dame Elisabeth Murdoch, Dame Enid Lyons, Sir John Monash, Sir Zelman Cowen, Sir Charles Court, Sir Robert Menzies and Sir MacFarlane Burnet etc.
To me it matters not whether the Queen (who is our Queen after all) or the Prime Minister instigates the award as it is still the recipient who earns their title. I hope we keep the highly recognisable titles, Dame and Sir, as our highest honour whether we are a Republic or a Monarchy.

That said, though Prince Philip has put a mammoth effort into the Duke of Edinburgh Awards - benefiting most Australian schools; I think a lesser award was fitting. I would have appointed another Australian to receive the highest honour of Knight or Dame. If I were Tony Abbott I'd be conferring more with my party members. Tony Abbott is so often awkward and inappropriate. He needs to consult more readily so to glean accurate assessment of what is acceptable to the public.

I hope Prince Philip doesn't feel too embarrassed.
He has been awarded the honour and he has made worthy contributions. I think we Australians should just get over it and pat him on the back - so to speak. It's not his fault that Tony Abbott acts like the Lone Ranger and makes obvious mistakes because of his stubbornness.
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  #505  
Old 01-28-2015, 08:50 PM
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Queen Elizabeth and the Duke of Edinburgh Current Events 27: December 2014

Quote:
Originally Posted by Roslyn View Post
I find it amusing that so many people who are not Australian are telling us that we are making a mountain out of a molehill.

Well this issue has marked another turning point for me. When I joined this board I was a monarchist but being part of discussions here forced me to examine my feelings on the subject and I became a republican. However I still wanted to retain the flag and not change it, but after this fiasco I am rethinking that, too, and I am not so sure I want the Union Jack on my national flag. The Eureka Flag is looking better and better to me.

I find that very strange that you would let a thing like this change your mind about the Flag.
I would never want to get rid of OUR flag no matter what Tony Abbott did and it was solely him.
I would never have guessed you were a republican either. While I'm not I can see that once the Queens dies we will become one.


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  #506  
Old 01-28-2015, 09:03 PM
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There are 2 main issues I draw from this latest debacle.

1. Politicains never really get what the people think - Abbott seems far removed from reality.
2. I would never want a politician as Head of State, working with a political leader.

So my view is that I am more inclined to a monarchy because of this stupid error than not. And the monarchy has behaved well, because they were too polite to turn it down and thereby embarassing Abbott.

But I would also add that the upgrade of an existing honour is hardly a matter for anyone to throw themselves on the barricades!
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  #507  
Old 01-28-2015, 09:17 PM
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Point number 2 is the reason I don't want to get rid of the monarchy.
My dad would say " if's not broke don't fix it "



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  #508  
Old 01-28-2015, 09:27 PM
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Originally Posted by royal rob View Post
Point number 2 is the reason I don't want to get rid of the monarchy.
My dad would say " if's not broke don't fix it "
I used to be in the "if it an't broke, don't fix it" school, too. But I now believe it is broken.

I didn't realise you are Australian. Do you really feel comfortable having a foreigner who lives in a foreign country and owes her primary allegiance to that foreign country, as your Head of State and representing you on the world stage? I don't want a politician as Head of State; I want the model that has the President appointed in the same manner as the G-G is currently appointed, but I'm in the minority as most Australians seem to favour the directly elected model who has more power, in the manner of the US system. So to that extent I am still in the "if it ain't broke, dont' fix it" camp, since I'd just like things to essentially remain as they are, with the G-G becoming Head of State.

We can't hold a State dinner for HM when she visits here, because she is our Head of State too and would be hosting it for herself.

And, silly as you may think it is, this knighthood for Philip has been the factor which has jolted my out of my complacency re the flag issue. If we're going to become a republic we should have and flag, too. South Africa got an absolutely splendid one. I want a distinctive one like that.
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  #509  
Old 01-28-2015, 10:19 PM
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No need for Brit bashing and bashing your own heritage.
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  #510  
Old 01-28-2015, 10:20 PM
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Yes I'm happy with the ways thing are I think it works well.
I can just see problems would arise any other way. But as I have said its days are numbered my children( adults ) are all for a change.
They are the future so that's their right


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I would however be very sad to see our flag changed. It could became let's change it whenever we want to
This is our flag forever


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  #511  
Old 01-28-2015, 11:31 PM
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I'm afraid I am responsible for leading the thread off track. There is a specific thread to discuss Australia becoming a republic and concomitant issues like the flag, and this is not it.
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  #512  
Old 01-28-2015, 11:42 PM
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I love our flag! The big dark blue space with the Southern Cross is what moves me most. Our night sky is magnificent. The union Jack is fine to indicate modern development and our peaceful, powerful structure of government and the seven pronged star has significance.
I agree with Cepe. I prefer the Monarchy. The Queen is predictable.

The only type of Republic I could live with would be a system where the Governor General is our Head of State. An appointed G.G. just the same as it is now. I would detest a 'President' and an elected Head of State. A democratically elected Prime Minister is the most powerful person for day to day concerns. I would want Australia to remain a member of the Commonwealth too. It is a strong, peaceful and historical alliance.

Our system of government has served us well - as have Queen Elizabeth and Prince Philip. Queen Elizabeth has a set role, we know it and it is clearly defined in the law.
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  #513  
Old 01-28-2015, 11:43 PM
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All I know, I wouldn't be cross if The President decided to honor The Queen or Prince Philip.
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  #514  
Old 01-29-2015, 12:53 AM
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Me neither!
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  #515  
Old 01-29-2015, 02:37 AM
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If Australia were to hold a new referendum on becoming a republic or not, the monarchy will probably win with an even bigger majority than in 1999. The support for a republic has fallen in recent years, especially among the young.
I can understand those who want a Australian head of state, but it's not going to happen. Australia is not going to become a republic, either now or when The Queen dies.
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  #516  
Old 01-29-2015, 04:11 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Roslyn View Post
.

We pay attention to it precisely because it is farcical. We don't want to be associated with something as absurd as this when we did not want it or agree to it in the first place. You are welcome to laugh at our stuffed cane toads or cockroach races, but we do not want to be ridiculed for something we did not want and do not embrace.

I was asking questions and trying to understand, there's simply no need for you to be rude and make assumptions that aren't true.
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  #517  
Old 01-29-2015, 05:38 AM
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Originally Posted by Lumutqueen View Post
I was asking questions and trying to understand, there's simply no need for you to be rude and make assumptions that aren't true.
This is how things go off the track here and turn personal and nasty, and totally unnecessarily, resulting in the mods swooping in and sending us to the naughty corner.

You asked, "Why is it such a big deal? I'm not trying to criticise, just understand really. The honours systems re-installed appears to be pretty farsical from what has been described so why pay much attention to it?"

I answered with my honest reasons as to why I am paying attention to it, and added a bit of self-deprecating humour to lighten things up. I was not rude and I made no assumptions, whether true or otherwise. But perhaps you are not aware of the stuffed cane toads or Australia Day cockroach races and interpreted what I said to mean something that wasn't intended.
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  #518  
Old 01-29-2015, 02:02 PM
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Queen Elizabeth and the Duke of Edinburgh Current Events 27: December 2014

The fact that you said "you are welcome to laugh" makes the assumption that a; I would laugh at your traditions and b; you appeared to be saying that by laughing I would be being rude. Neither of which are correct.
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  #519  
Old 01-29-2015, 02:13 PM
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Well clearly PM Abbot has failed to protect the Queen and the Monarchy from unnecessary criticism. Personally I would always think the spouse to a long serving head of state (bar dictators and their spouses) should be honoured in some way and I personally think Philip has done a fair bit for Australia. However given the large public backlash Abbot was silly to push ahead for such an honour as its led to a discussion over the monarchy again.
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  #520  
Old 01-29-2015, 05:02 PM
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Originally Posted by Lumutqueen View Post
The fact that you said "you are welcome to laugh" makes the assumption that a; I would laugh at your traditions and b; you appeared to be saying that by laughing I would be being rude. Neither of which are correct.
Heck, these are very peculiar "traditions" and I would expect everyone to laugh at them. That was my point. They are funny, peculiar, things we do knowing they are ridiculous, and we expect to be laughed at for them, but not for cringe-worthy things that our PM does that we did not know about or approve. But enough about that misunderstanding, which was clearly caused by my failed attempt at humour. Time to move on.
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