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  #341  
Old 03-31-2012, 02:43 AM
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But why then only the (visibly) bad relation Cristina-Letizia? If the Asturias were that far-sighted in terms of Inaki's wrongdoing (we dont even know to what extent the King knew) why wasnt there the slightest (visible) hint of a problem between Felipe & Cristina, let alone Inaki-Letizia or Inaki-Felipe. People are now claiming that Felipe knew all along and has been the strong force to cut Inaki off when the King couldnt make up his mind, cant really see how that could be the case, I see him as rather weak in this whole issue, he always posed with a smile with his sister and the alleged culprit (apparantly long known within the family) and never ever made the attempt to (visibly) back up his wife against those rumours circulating in the past years.

I doubt Felipe had or has much say in anything, Letizia even less, so why would Cristina be angry with Letizia mainly re the Inaki issue when Letizia basically was a non-influence in the whole saga. The King decided on events or whatever back then as he does now, and never (visibly) kind of socialised with the Asturias in public, especially not with his DIL.

For me the Inaki issue being the whole reason is too easy, it may have been a factor among others, eg character clash or Letizia trying get a more active role at early stages at Cristina's or general Infanta's expense (Elena never seemed too charmed by her SIL either), far more plausible for me.
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  #342  
Old 03-31-2012, 03:25 AM
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Duke, now the Spanish TVs have been showing clips of Felipe looking angry at Inaki, Felipe and Cristina ignored each other when walked together or passed by, Paloma B even had a program on 'Felipe and Cristina not talking to each other'. There were already whispers about Inaki's business in the media in 2004 when Inaki became the VP of the Spanish Olympic Committee, Felipe (and Letizia) already saw the irregularities of Inaki's business in 2004 due to Felipe's connection in the business circle and Letizia's in the media. Back in 2004, Felipe was too green, not had enough power or influence (as today), he couldn't do anything other than probably voiced his opinions to his father, distanced himself from Inaki and his sister who has always been supporting her husband.

Felipe and Cristina used to be very close when Felipe was single. I'm not surprised at all Cristina was angry after her beloved brother didn't support her hubby's business and moved away from her, of course, Letizia has always been the woman behind her brother, thus also angry at Letizia, later (after Letizia came back from her 2nd maternity leave) probably other issues came up as well, for example (as you said) the agendas of their activities. Letizia and Elena haven't been close because Felipe and Elena haven't been close to begin with, but they don't have big issues either, actually Letizia gets along better with Jaime. After the relation with her brother turned sour, Cristina has become closer to her sister Elena. Later Elena felt her sister was the only one in the family who understood her desire for divorce, the others (minus Letizia, not her business) probably all preferred her staying in the marriage with Jaime.
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  #343  
Old 03-31-2012, 04:25 AM
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Duke, the press publicized the "bad" relationship between the Princess and Cristina simply because Letizia was the center of everything, all the news and information revolved around her, that was what they wanted. What happened in the rest of the family was not important. Funny how absurd news about the princess (her hair, her shoes, her teeth), appeared and covered most unsettling news about other family members.

When the scandal broke some TV rescued Urdangarin old images, and there is a video of the Prince and Iñaki at an Olympic event in the Royal Palace, where the gestures show very well how things were.
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  #344  
Old 03-31-2012, 05:30 AM
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I am not saying that the Inaki issue didnt play a part, when looking now at the extent I am sure there was a huge impact, but I dont believe that it was the only reason for bad relations, like, if Inaki had never caused any problems the family would be living happily ever after. I believe they have been dysfunctial all the way but was brushed under the carpet as part of the family code, but that didnt work any longer with "commoner" in laws coming into the family who brought along a different way/understanding of living. For me power struggles & relationship problems caused by the new family units within the SRF had a similar impact on the family, exposing it to the core, the keeping of the Spanish throne, as much as the Inaki issue.
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  #345  
Old 03-31-2012, 06:10 AM
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As families grow, there are always problems, and that's normal. You choose your husband or your wife, not your parents-in-law or brothers-in-law. Probably in a Royal Family where life and work are one, that's even more complicated.

It is from the summer of 2006, when the Infanta Cristina starts putting bad face in the familiar photos, is at the time when the Asturias stop visiting the house of Barcelona... I believe that Iñaki's problems were which turned the normal problems of a family, in something deeper.
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  #346  
Old 03-31-2012, 06:46 AM
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Originally Posted by lula View Post
It is from the summer of 2006, when the Infanta Cristina starts putting bad face in the familiar photos, is at the time when the Asturias stop visiting the house of Barcelona... I believe that Iñaki's problems were which turned the normal problems of a family, in something deeper.
Not really. The SRF minus King went, including the Asturias, all (fake) smiles, to the Palma house in Barcelona in 2008 in private and posed for the photographers. There was no need to do so if the irregulartities were known as grave as suggested. There would have been a million excuses not to go there and pose with the alleged culprit in front of the camera.
If in 2004 and 2006 F&L were so annoyed by Inakis actions, why did they pose? Maybe because they thought that the wrongdoing was solved by the move to Washington that the King had mapped out by the time?
I just dont see what makes Felipe the saint in this story, who knew and took action and distanced himself. I dont see where he is better than his father, thinking that Telefonicas money & distance will solve the problem.

It is clear that the SRF was more concerned about the image harm than about the actual (criminal) activity. Had Inaki never got caught, they would still indulge in the fake golden happy family image. But he did and now they are doing the spin to distance themselves, again for image reasons.

http://images2.image-data.com/images...2/93522027.jpg

the bold part: agree very much so.
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  #347  
Old 03-31-2012, 07:00 AM
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I can't help but feel that, rather than attempt to cover all this up, Juan Carlos should have openly and clearly addressed the Inaki issue as soon as it came up. It could have been dealt with using the proper channels and the SRF would in 2012 be several years down the line at re-building the reputation of the institution and the reputations of the individuals involved. It also would've come out when Spain was enjoying the economic boom times, whereas having all this come out now with Spain suffering an awful recession, desperate unemployment and incredibly painful austerity just makes it all so much worse, and so much more dangerous.
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  #348  
Old 03-31-2012, 09:44 AM
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The distance between Asturias and Palma began in 2006, not 2004. I believe that in all the families it is necessary to put in many occasions, a smile in familiar events, though there is a relative that you do not like. Iñaki's 40 birthday was a big party, with many guests and the press in the door ... they did what they had to do. But in the previous years the Asturias had done private visits to Barcelona ... they were going to the cinema, to have dinner ... and it ended in 2006.

Iñaki Urdagarín was doing business that the Royal Family did not considered appropriate. But there is a big difference between something not appropriate and that may give a bad image ... and something that is illegal. Doing business with the public administration is not appropriate for a member of the Royal Family, but it is not illegal. All the corruption case has become known 8 years later, after a long investigation. The king is not police or judge, one thing is that he thought that his son in law did not act well, and other that he knew he was committing crimes. His business was not appropriate and asked him to leave and seek paid employment.
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  #349  
Old 04-02-2012, 02:31 PM
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The Anti-Corruption Prosecutor has objected again to the charge of the Infanta Cristina in the context of the investigation focused on the alleged irregularities committed by the Institute Nóos

La Fiscalía se opone de nuevo a la imputación de la Infanta Cristina
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  #350  
Old 04-03-2012, 11:10 AM
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Originally Posted by lula View Post
I believe that in all the families it is necessary to put in many occasions, a smile in familiar events, though there is a relative that you do not like.

Iñaki Urdagarín was doing business that the Royal Family did not considered appropriate. But there is a big difference between something not appropriate and that may give a bad image ... and something that is illegal. Doing business with the public administration is not appropriate for a member of the Royal Family, but it is not illegal. All the corruption case has become known 8 years later, after a long investigation. The king is not police or judge, one thing is that he thought that his son in law did not act well, and other that he knew he was committing crimes. His business was not appropriate and asked him to leave and seek paid employment.
I believe that this is the best interpretation of events so far by someone without actual knowledge inside Royal Family and without a personal like/dislike adjenda on the Spanish Royals popping through their critique. That was all I wanted, facts on a time-line. We can all certainly relate to having someone in our families, whether through birth or marriage, that we wish would disappear but due to proper manners, we must be polite in public. And, we are not in the public eye and having photos taken at every event! It seems to me that Letizia MIGHT have been used by intercircle to camouflage the true drama going on at that time. If this is so, I give her all the credit in the world for enduring the press quietly [although loosing a lot of weight in the process]. No wonder Felipe was always at her side to protect.

I certainly agree that something that is not 100% appropriate [which I hope that Inaki thought he was doing] is certainly nothing like committing an actual crime. If, in fact he did commit this crime knowingly, a jail sentence would be the only course of action and would save the Royal Family from whispers of "back-door interference" with the laws. Anything less will be the death of the Spanish Royals as trust worthy leaders. What an awful shame for the Queen, who in my opinion will be heartbroken due to the actions of a turgid sports figure.
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  #351  
Old 04-04-2012, 07:46 PM
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Originally Posted by Duke of Marmalade View Post
I just dont see what makes Felipe the saint in this story, who knew and took action and distanced himself. I dont see where he is better than his father, thinking that Telefonicas money & distance will solve the problem.

....
Not a saint, just a bit of common sense that seemed lacking in his parents and sisters. Time has passed for the royals to act like they can get away from anything. Felipe distanced himself from his dear sister not because of what Inaki had done, it was because Cristina had been so defensive of her hubby (it had been said in all the media), it was not possible to communicate with her anymore. There was already voice against royals doing business back in 2004, for example the former head of household, a loyal monarchist Sabino Fernández Campo had spoken openly against royals doing business, many others probably agreed with him, but chose to remain quiet not to criticize the King (it was still 2004, not today), I wonder what they said to the Princes who have been actively in contact with various sectors of the Spanish society after their marriage.

Inaki was not even opening a gym, a school or a shoe store, he had been selling the so called business strategies, future plans and etc. to the business owners who didn't know what he was doing mostly, but they still paid him because he is a son-in-law of the King . Don't know how did the King let him do that, perhaps he thought Inaki was too poor (JC was rumored to tell his friends his sons-in-law were very poor), he wanted his daughter and grandkids to live better. The King knew it was a big mistake, so when Elena started a financial consultant firm right after the divorce, he immediately shut it down.
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  #352  
Old 04-17-2012, 12:08 AM
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El exsocio de Urdangarin implica al Rey en negocios a favor de su yerno | Política | EL PAÍS
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  #353  
Old 04-30-2012, 01:33 PM
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Urdangarín también implicó en sus negocios a la hermana del Rey, la infanta Pilar - Vanitatis
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  #354  
Old 04-30-2012, 02:36 PM
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Is Infanta Pilar involved or being investigated?
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  #355  
Old 04-30-2012, 02:49 PM
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Is Infanta Pilar involved or being investigated?
I'm wondering the same thing, An Ard Ri.
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  #356  
Old 04-30-2012, 03:18 PM
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Is Infanta Pilar involved or being investigated?
Infanta Pilar is not involved in the corruption case, nor is she under the investigation.
She was merely asked by Inaki (who, according to the article, she always had a soft spot for) to raise funds - which she did in good faith that the funds were to be used for charitable causes, not go into Inaki's pockets.
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  #357  
Old 04-30-2012, 03:30 PM
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Infanta Pilar is not involved in the corruption case, nor is she under the investigation.
She was merely asked by Inaki (who, according to the article, she always had a soft spot for) to raise funds - which she did in good faith that the funds were to be used for charitable causes, not go into Inaki's pockets.
Thanks Artemisia
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  #358  
Old 05-01-2012, 04:38 AM
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Urdangarín offers to return 3.7 million and plead guilty to avoid jail

According to sources close to negotiations, the offer of the Duke of Palma has three points: the accused admits his criminal responsibility for crimes of embezzlement, fraud management, forgery and tax evasion, returns to the Treasury between 3.7 and 4 million euros, and in return, the prosecution calls for him a sentence less than two years in prison. The key is this request of the Prosecutor. Having no criminal record, even if convicted of these crimes by mutual agreement, to be worth less than two years in prison would not go to jail.

Urdangarn ofrece devolver 3,7 millones y declararse culpable para evitar la crcel - ABC.es
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  #359  
Old 05-01-2012, 05:07 AM
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Wow. So he's basically admitting his guilt? I can't see how you can admit to stealing almost 4 million euros from the public purse and not face jail time?
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  #360  
Old 05-01-2012, 09:08 AM
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Wow. So he's basically admitting his guilt? I can't see how you can admit to stealing almost 4 million euros from the public purse and not face jail time?
Things like this happen all the time when there is pressure from "higher-ups". Plea bargains so that trial by jury are eclipsed is quite common. Court systems are overloaded so this is made even easier. They claim it saves money in the long run. I personally believe that public community service for a huge amount of hours would serve this case better, plus the sale of personal items to pay back the money.
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