York Family News and Pictures 1: September 2003-September 2015


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Osipi, don't tell me you want Sarah in a guiding role as a grandmother! In Starkie's book she wasn't actually the perfect mother she likes to call herself to her own daughters, she seems to find them more interesting now they are grown and she can wear clothes like them and have the good times that young people have and she feels she has missed out on.
As to your being given the title Mr John Smith (your example) that is the correct way of addressing a letter to a married woman, it gives you the shivers? It shouldn't because if you were addressed as Mrs Osipi Smith then you would be a widow.
In general I am sick of this constant harping on her doing charity work, if it were hands on nursing or taking the night round of handing out soup to the homeless, which I am fairly sure it doesn't, then I would change my mind. But when I think of Sarah doing charity work it brings to mind a very cheering chat and banter with some sufferer and then a nice thank you for the flowers and then a chauffeur driven car to take her home in time for tea after a hard day's charity work (well earned in her way of thinking).
I am sorry to say Sarah brings out the cynic in me, I don't want it to but it crops up spontaneously.
 
Osipi, don't tell me you want Sarah in a guiding role as a grandmother! In Starkie's book she wasn't actually the perfect mother she likes to call herself to her own daughters, she seems to find them more interesting now they are grown and she can wear clothes like them and have the good times that young people have and she feels she has missed out on.
As to your being given the title Mr John Smith (your example) that is the correct way of addressing a letter to a married woman, it gives you the shivers? It shouldn't because if you were addressed as Mrs Osipi Smith then you would be a widow.
In general I am sick of this constant harping on her doing charity work, if it were hands on nursing or taking the night round of handing out soup to the homeless, which I am fairly sure it doesn't, then I would change my mind. But when I think of Sarah doing charity work it brings to mind a very cheering chat and banter with some sufferer and then a nice thank you for the flowers and then a chauffeur driven car to take her home in time for tea after a hard day's charity work (well earned in her way of thinking).
I am sorry to say Sarah brings out the cynic in me, I don't want it to but it crops up spontaneously.

Actually I think Sarah will be a doting grandmother.. perhaps a bit too doting but.. that's Sarah. As Beatrice and Eugenie mature, they're gonna have to learn to say "no Mom" and to be honest, I think they will. Parents need to let go. I don't see Sarah as a guiding grandmother but doting. She'll love them to death.

As her children get older and have kids of their own, there will have to be a change. Many of us see it as the "empty nest" syndrome and that's the reason I think that Sarah probably could be better off finding something that is Sarah and not attached to Andrew, the kids or Joe the Plumber down the block. Its one reason I feel that what she is doing now and has been doing is confusing self esteem with self image. Her own charity could do that for her if she wanted it to.

To be blunt, we're also facing the reality that Sarah is likely going through menopause. Its bad enough for most women but with a woman that is so in the public eye and none good, its a recipe for depression... big time. I'm surprised no one has mentioned this yet. I been there, done it and froze the hubby out of the room clutching mega blankets and it really IS the time you take a good long look at who you are and ask stupid questions like "why am I here?". Its a normal phase of life but with Sarah I saw that "me" in her when she talks about Kate and "that was me last up the aisle" kind of thing. Thing is what I thought and said perhaps wasn't in the tabloids the next day or aired on TV. Perhaps she's giving a last hurrah attempt to recapture what she once had. My bill from Oil of Old Lady shows me I did the same. :D

As I said before, Sarah has Children in Crisis. That could be her lifeline.

Just trying to throw some perspectives in on this.
 
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In Portugal the wife keeps her own name so we would get Sarah Ferguson and (here) it would not be wrong, in fact a wife can just decide not to have her husband's name at all, off subject I suppose but it is the reason that Prince William's wife is usually referred to here as Kate Middleton which sounds strange to foreign ears.
I must admit I like being called by my first name too, and nowadays gone to the same place as Esquire I suppose, as it is just a formal use limited to envelopes we can relax. LOL. . (Sorry Zonk, but I did mention Sarah).
 
In Portugal the wife keeps her own name so we would get Sarah Ferguson and (here) it would not be wrong, in fact a wife can just decide not to have her husband's name at all, off subject I suppose but it is the reason that Prince William's wife is usually referred to here as Kate Middleton which sounds strange to foreign ears.
I must admit I like being called by my first name too, and nowadays gone to the same place as Esquire I suppose, as it is just a formal use limited to envelopes we can relax. LOL. . (Sorry Zonk, but I did mention Sarah).

Her royal Zonkness can probably (I'm assuming) can understand why the "proper" wording of names and titles does very much fit in with the discussion of Sarah. Diarist explains it and its like something I've never heard before. Its also a good reason why the public is still being taken in and "fooled" to believe that she is actually a Duchess of York and not a former one. There's a difference between being really royal or a peer and holding onto a title and presenting it in a way that you seem royal or a peer.

And I will refer to Diana. To her credit, she did correct those that called her Princess Diana during her marriage and afterwards. She didn't "work" the title per se. Sarah till her dying day will be Duchess of York as her main achievement unless she does realize that she is a person in her own right. That's the difference.

I am known actually by a lot of different names from over the years and going on 30 years of being hooked to a shoestring and box called a computer. i still answer to 'you there..'

My point i guess is that I hope Sarah does find out who the 'you there' is.
 
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Before I launch into a rebuttal, here's an attempt to remain on topic!:D Sarah and her daughters are in Spain, last weekend, Eugenie and her boyfriend Jack were spotted at the polo. For the past few years they have holidayed in Spain, Andrew has previously joined them there and 2 years ago that's where Beatrice celebrated her 21st. Andrew was spotted frolicking on a yacht (also an annual holiday, as I now there have been past photos of him) he was then seen catching a flight to Scotland so he must have gone up to Balmoral.

Actually, in my humble opinion, had Sarah declared bankruptcy, I expect that her creditors could have done equally as well or perhaps even better with regard to money. Australian bankruptcy I know nothing about, but in England and Wales, the bankrupt's Trustee in bankruptcy then takes over most of a person's property [basically leaving you the 'tools of your trade']. Sarah would immediately have lost her collection of exquisite and valuable jewellery. The famous Louis Vuitton luggage that you have mentioned would have gone, as would her designer clothes. Such items, as well as their instrinsic vintage worth, would have had an enhanced value because of their provenance. Sarah also owns some nice items of valuable furniture apparently. Bang!! All that would have gone under the Auctioneer's hammer. But the real loss would apparently be her real estate: it is always not entirely clear what Sarah owns, but it seems that there is her mother's estancia and its lucrative polo pony breeding business, and there has been mention in the British press about an appartment in new York, property in England and in Italy. She is also reputedly the beneficiary of a portion of her late father's will; the Dummer Farmhouse and remaining land, presently the home of her stepmother Susan, has reputedly been left to Susan for life and then to Major Ferguson's children, Sarah and her sister Jane and his children by Susan. I therefore think that it was a HUGE advantage to Sarah in not declaring bankruptcy - her debts have been settled by others and her own capital apparently remains intact....

Ok so a little dose of reality here in regards to what assets Sarah actually has and why declaring bankrupcy (on either occasion would have seen her creditors with little or nothing)

Sarah does not own the apartment in New York, it's leased, when Hartmoor went under she couldn't keep up the rental payments and so she sublet it. In 2001 Sarah did buy an investment property in Italy with the Italian count she she seeing, the idea was to turn it into a spa and holiday resort. Nothing came of that, so I've no doubt that it was quietly sold off.
The ranch in Argentina was heavily in debt, Susan Barrantes sold half of it to Kerry Packer (Australian millionaire who played polo) it was inherited by Hector Barrantes' brother Martin (Jane and Sarah Ferguson have a share in in, but not a controlling or large share) Martin's son Rafael runs the polo ponies business, it's his business Sarah doesn't have an interest or derives an income from it. Rafael lives on the ranch, his father doesn't.

Sarah owns a great deal of exquisite jewellery, well that's would be news to her. She does own the parure that was given to her for her wedding, (tiara, necklace, bracelets) but the jewellery that she owns wouldn't be anywhere near the value of the 4 million pounds (1990s) 2 to 4 million (depending of what source you use) that would clear the debts she had. Plus any good financial advisor worth his salt would have told her to put the jewellery in someone else's name before declaring bankruptcy!
Last year when Andrew's accountant tried to sort out Sarah's finances, what assets she owned were looked at. They consisted a a Bentley car (given to her as a gift from her Norwegian millionaire) but broken down mechanically since Sarah couldn't afford to get it repaired. (Andrew repaired it for her either for Christmas or her birthday last year) And a few paintings (no mention of furniture, infact none has ever been mentioned)
Dummer Down Farm is to be inherited by her brother Andrew, he farms it currently. Wills are made public in the UK, so the press could have easily found out if Sarah were to inherit a large sum it would be public knowledge, even if she had gotten anything after his death.

Ardent and RJ-H are different in my opinion. Prince Edward's company, as you so rightly say, went into receivership. Ditto RJ-H. But to me, the difference is that these were businesses that tried to trade. Sarah's financial woes - as wiser forum members than me have posted here - are the result of years and years of uncontrolled personal spending. As we know, Ardent was a film maker and RJ-H was a PR company. Sarah's company, Hartmoor, might well have been a victim of the recession, but the real reason for its demise must surely lie in the fact that it was UK analysts have described:- it was a flawed business model right from the start, as its 'stock in trade' was ''the Sarah brand' '', not the bona fide business of film making and PR. Hartmoor was set up in 2006 to manage Sarah's principally American-based career in publishing, media and public speaking. But, if we are really honest, Sarah may well be an excellent public speaker and she has published books and appeared on numerous TV programmes, but isn't the real reason for the public success she has met in this area her connection with Royalty?

The comparison with Ardent and RJH is relevant, Ardent was also a flawed business model, in all the years it traded it never made a profit. The only productions that it did make that made some money were the documentaries on royalty (shades of Sarah and her connections here!?) Edward also charged Ardent a rental fee for its use of the Bagshot stables as its offices, the company was loosing money but he was still milking it for what he could get. RJH got into trouble since Sophie also was accused of using her royal connections to promote the products or events from her PR company. (Her death knell was the 'fake sheik', that scandal forced her to withdraw from the day to day running of the company but she remained on the board, and I would assume received payment until 2 or 3 years ago when RJH was closed and its assets sold to cover the creditors, it didn't manage to do that)
Sarah's financial problems stemmed from Hartmoor's demise and some very bad financial advice she was given. While it may be your opinion and certainly one fueled by the tabloids that it was because of Sarah's 'uncontrolled spending' try looking at exactly what happened with Hartmoor. The business closed with $1,000,000 in debts,(it had a large number of employees and was leasing offices on Madison Ave, one of the most expensive parts of New York!) the lawyers then got involved, at any one meeting there were multiple lawyers all charging by the hour. When their bills were not paid, Sarah was then being charged interest on the bill, it then got to the stage where she was being charged interest on the interest. Her debt spiralled. I won't make the claim that Sarah is some sort of financial wizard, clearly she's not, she got bad advice, being the eternal optimist (this description from an aquaintance of mine who moves in the same circles) she believed she would set herself up financially. (John Bryant made the same claim during his 'financial advisor days!) She made a huge mistake in that she resigned from her Weight Watchers role (they confirmed it was Sarah who made the break, not the other way around). Sarah signed up with the Washington Speaker's Bureau (Her keynote speeches aren't actually about the royals, her profile included what she talks about and it's all motivational type talks) but with economic downturns, also comes downturns in conventions and conferences and companies prepared to pay large sums of money for a keynote speaker.
 
Before I launch into a rebuttal, here's an attempt to remain on topic!:D Sarah and her daughters are in Spain, last weekend, Eugenie and her boyfriend Jack were spotted at the polo. For the past few years they have holidayed in Spain, Andrew has previously joined them there and 2 years ago that's where Beatrice celebrated her 21st. Andrew was spotted frolicking on a yacht (also an annual holiday, as I now there have been past photos of him) he was then seen catching a flight to Scotland so he must have gone up to Balmoral.

Actually, in my humble opinion, had Sarah declared bankruptcy, I expect that her creditors could have done equally as well or perhaps even better with regard to money. Australian bankruptcy I know nothing about, but in England and Wales, the bankrupt's Trustee in bankruptcy then takes over most of a person's property [basically leaving you the 'tools of your trade']. But the real loss would apparently be her real estate: it is always not entirely clear what Sarah owns, but it seems that there is her mother's estancia and its lucrative polo pony breeding business, and there has been mention in the British press about an appartment in new York, property in England and in Italy. She is also reputedly the beneficiary of a portion of her late father's will; the Dummer Farmhouse and remaining land, presently the home of her stepmother Susan, has reputedly been left to Susan for life and then to Major Ferguson's children, Sarah and her sister Jane and his children by Susan. I therefore think that it was a HUGE advantage to Sarah in not declaring bankruptcy - her debts have been settled by others and her own capital apparently remains intact....

Ok so a little dose of reality here in regards to what assets Sarah actually has and why declaring bankrupcy (on either occasion would have seen her creditors with little or nothing)

Sarah does not own the apartment in New York, it's leased, when Hartmoor went under she couldn't keep up the rental payments and so she sublet it. In 2001 Sarah did buy an investment property in Italy with the Italian count she she seeing, the idea was to turn it into a spa and holiday resort. Nothing came of that, so I've no doubt that it was quietly sold off.
The ranch in Argentina was heavily in debt, Susan Barrantes sold half of it to Kerry Packer (Australian millionaire who played polo) it was inherited by Hector Barrantes' brother Martin (Jane and Sarah Ferguson have a share in in, but not a controlling or large share) Martin's son Rafael runs the polo ponies business, it's his business Sarah doesn't have an interest or derives an income from it. Rafael lives on the ranch, his father doesn't.

Sarah owns a great deal of exquisite jewellery, well that's would be news to her. She does own the parure that was given to her for her wedding, (tiara, necklace, bracelets) but the jewellery that she owns wouldn't be anywhere near the value of the 4 million pounds (1990s) 2 to 4 million (depending of what source you use) that would clear the debts she had. Plus any good financial advisor worth his salt would have told her to put the jewellery in someone else's name before declaring bankruptcy!
Last year when Andrew's accountant tried to sort out Sarah's finances, what assets she owned were looked at. They consisted a a Bentley car (given to her as a gift from her Norwegian millionaire) but broken down mechanically since Sarah couldn't afford to get it repaired. (Andrew repaired it for her either for Christmas or her birthday last year) And a few paintings (no mention of furniture, infact none has ever been mentioned)
Dummer Down Farm is to be inherited by her brother Andrew, he farms it currently. Wills are made public in the UK, so the press could have easily found out if Sarah were to inherit a large sum it would be public knowledge, even if she had gotten anything after his death.

Ardent and RJ-H are different in my opinion. Prince Edward's company, as you so rightly say, went into receivership. Ditto RJ-H. But to me, the difference is that these were businesses that tried to trade. Sarah's financial woes - as wiser forum members than me have posted here - are the result of years and years of uncontrolled personal spending. As we know, Ardent was a film maker and RJ-H was a PR company. Sarah's company, Hartmoor, might well have been a victim of the recession, but the real reason for its demise must surely lie in the fact that it was UK analysts have described:- it was a flawed business model right from the start, as its 'stock in trade' was ''the Sarah brand' '', not the bona fide business of film making and PR. Hartmoor was set up in 2006 to manage Sarah's principally American-based career in publishing, media and public speaking.

The comparison with Ardent and RJH is relevant, Ardent was also a flawed business model, in all the years it traded it never made a profit. The only productions that it did make that made some money were the documentaries on royalty (shades of Sarah and her connections here!?) Edward also charged Ardent a rental fee for its use of the Bagshot stables as its offices, the company was loosing money but he was still milking it for what he could get. RJH got into trouble since Sophie also was accused of using her royal connections to promote the products or events from her PR company. (Her death knell was the 'fake sheik', that scandal forced her to withdraw from the day to day running of the company but she remained on the board, and I would assume received payment until 2 or 3 years ago when RJH was closed and its assets sold to cover the creditors, it didn't manage to do that)
Sarah's financial problems stemmed from Hartmoor's demise and some very bad financial advice she was given. While it may be your opinion and certainly one fueled by the tabloids that it was because of Sarah's 'uncontrolled spending' try looking at exactly what happened with Hartmoor. The business closed with $1,000,000 in debts,(it had a large number of employees and was leasing offices on Madison Ave, one of the most expensive parts of New York!) the lawyers then got involved, at any one meeting there were multiple lawyers all charging by the hour. When their bills were not paid, Sarah was then being charged interest on the bill, it then got to the stage where she was being charged interest on the interest. Her debt spiralled. I won't make the claim that Sarah is some sort of financial wizard, clearly she's not, she got bad advice, being the eternal optimist (this description from an aquaintance of mine who moves in the same circles) she believed she would set herself up financially. (John Bryant made the same claim during his 'financial advisor days!) She made a huge mistake in that she resigned from her Weight Watchers role (they confirmed it was Sarah who made the break, not the other way around). Sarah signed up with the Washington Speaker's Bureau (Her keynote speeches aren't actually about the royals, her profile included what she talks about and it's all motivational type talks) but with economic downturns, also comes downturns in conventions and conferences and companies prepared to pay large sums of money for a keynote speaker.

This was first seen in respect of the Queen's children when Gatcombe Park was 'given to Princess Anne and Mark Philips' by the Queen as a 'wedding gift'. But poor old Mark Philips NEVER had any legal interest in the property, which was put into the name of Anne alone [source; The Times]

The Mark Philips divorce settlement is another example of how Sarah's settlement wasn't as good. Gatcombe Park was bought in 1976, it included a large amount of farmland, Mark Philips had decided to leave the army and become a farmer. The Gatcombe acreage wasn't enough so in 1977 Anne and Mark went to buy the farm next door, Aston Farm. They didn't have the money the Queen lent it to them on a lease to buy option. Move to 1992 when the Philips divorce was finalised, Anne got to keep Gatcombe and Mark got Aston Farm, where he still lives to this day. His son Peter and family also live in a cottage on Aston Farm. Mark's settlement also included that he could continue to farm Gatcombe (although now he mainly works as an equestian consultant) and continue to derive an income from Gatcombe through shooting parties where people pay to shoot and the Horse Trials. Peter Philips is now involved in much of the organisation. Sarah didn't end up with a house of any kind, even if one had been bought it was to be in her daughters' names, she also wasn't given an option in regards to earning any kind of income.

A media career is one that she's chosen for herself, with the Oprah deal, she was paid $200,000 for (and lets be generous here, 3 to 4 months work, 2to 3 months filming, a month promoting. (I know to some it seemed longer but it was a month where she went on a variety of TV shows to promote the series) Where else would a 51 year old woman with obsolete secretarial skills earn that kind of money in 4 months? (Not to mention a woman heavily in debt!) In the early 2000s she was paid $400,000 by the US Today show to be their showbiz/royalty reporter. Her speaking engagements earned her $20,000 an engagement, that's what she charged and received. Yes she spent big but she also earned big, and she poured a lot of money into Hartmoor. And now we're back to well she lost it all. It will be interesting to see if the 'Sarah' brand is damaged in the US or not, currently she has over 27,000 followers on Twitter (it's steadily increasing, I've been checking!:D) and it's not all reporters!
 
Charlotte1 - I think that is one of the best posts I have ever read. :flowers:
 
Yes she spent big but she also earned big, and she poured a lot of money into Hartmoor. And now we're back to well she lost it all. It will be interesting to see if the 'Sarah' brand is damaged in the US or not, currently she has over 27,000 followers on Twitter (it's steadily increasing, I've been checking!:D) and it's not all reporters!

Well, speaking for myself only, the "Sarah" brand is damaged in the U.S.

To explain: My first recollections of Fergie are all scandal related-ie, her appearance in the tabloids in 1992 and her later debt problems. I was about 6-7 when she and Andrew married and have no recollection of her "honeymoon period".

So, when Sarah was working to clear her debts (Weight Watchers) and doing PR (Oprah is my main memory), while I certainly didn't condone her behavior, I do remember admiring her for doing what she needed to do to get out of debt. At the time, she seemed very honest and humble about ALL of her mistakes. I didn't sense a whiny, self-pitying attitude. I also admired how she and Andrew seemed to handle themselves post-separation and divorce.

When the "cash for access" scandal hit, I was appalled and rather disgusted. My main thought was: Had she not learned ANYTHING? It also seemed worse--trading on Andrew's name for money. Then, there has been her attitude since then. I haven't sensed her being honest about the "cash for access" scandal. She hasn't seemed to really take responsibility for anything this time around. There seems to be too much for whining. Involving her daughters (I realize this was their choice, too though.) didn't do much for me.

So, from where I sit, she's pretty damaged in the U.S. I have no idea if my thoughts fit the mainstream though. Or if people even care anymore. She's pretty removed from the royals now, beyond her daughters and Andrew and the past with Diana.

I will say that Americans tend to like a good, contrite apology and to see someone just saying "I was wrong", ie- taking responsibility. People get lots of second-and third-chances around here.
 
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Please note that there are several Sarah specific threads where members can discuss Sarah and her "issues"

http://www.theroyalforums.com/forum...current-events-16-1-june-2011-a-31225-25.html
http://www.theroyalforums.com/forum...rom-the-cash-for-access-scandal-28208-49.html
http://www.theroyalforums.com/forum...york-cash-for-access-may-2010-a-27721-40.html
http://www.theroyalforums.com/forums/f113/sarahs-interviews-and-television-appearances-31280-37.html
http://www.theroyalforums.com/forum...f-york-charities-and-patronages-18720-10.html
http://www.theroyalforums.com/forum...ndrews-home-royal-lodge-windsor-15764-13.html
http://www.theroyalforums.com/forum...e-divorce-and-divorce-settlement-30602-7.html

The purpose of this thread is post and discuss general information when more than 2 Yorks travel together. Instead of discussing it in each of the respective (Andrew, Sarah, Beatrice and/or Eugenie) current events threads.

I've requested that we stay on topic MANY TIMES, closed threads for massive clean ups, moved, edited and copied posts to the correct threads that deal with the specific topic BUT NOT ANYMORE. Going forward, if its off topic, it will be deleted.

If there are any questions, please contact any of the British moderators via Private Message.

Zonk

 
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__________________


The Duchess of York with Princess Eugenie and Princess Beatrice arrived at a hotel in central Rome
for the wedding of Formula One owner Bernie Ecclestone's daughter Petra, on August 26, 2011.
Petra will marry James Stunt, at the Odescalchi castle in Bracciano, near Rome, on August 27.


** Pic 1 ** Pic 2 ** Pic 3 ** belga gallery **
 
I have to say it she is looking rough. After several weeks of holidays I would expect her too look a little better! Guess she gets to go to a big wedding.
 
Sarah IMO looks like many a person who has traveled on an airplane, had to go thru customs, get your bags, and be transferred to your hotel when traveling. Tired. Not everyone can look like Posh Spice when coming off a plane.
 
OR, she is playing the part of a poor, pitiful, poverty stricken woman. Travelling does not preclude combing one's hair and putting on some liptstick, IMO. She looks awful!!!!
 
Some of the other guests, per the pictures - the other Fergie and Paris Hilton.
 
Eh to me she looks tired and sans makeup not that bad really.
 
Sarah IMO looks like many a person who has traveled on an airplane, had to go thru customs, get your bags, and be transferred to your hotel when traveling. Tired. Not everyone can look like Posh Spice when coming off a plane.
Indeed, however she could have put a pair of dark glasses on to help hide that so she didn't look so very bad. At this point in her life she ought ot be very well aware that the press is out to make her look as bad as they can. it sells, unfortunately.
 
Indeed, however she could have put a pair of dark glasses on to help hide that so she didn't look so very bad. At this point in her life she ought ot be very well aware that the press is out to make her look as bad as they can. it sells, unfortunately.

What a far cry from the glamor shot on the cover of her book eh? I definitely can agree with her being tired, grumpy and perhaps disheveled after flight but she could have taken some pride and made herself a bit more presentable. She looks like she's been in the eye of Irene for a week. Appearing like this also makes her look a lot older than what she really is.
 
OR, she is playing the part of a poor, pitiful, poverty stricken woman. Travelling does not preclude combing one's hair and putting on some liptstick, IMO. She looks awful!!!!

Please can I help with a little information, as I do know a bit about airport VIP arrangements from my own work:

Despite Zonk's gloomy musings, I can definitely say that even though Beatrice and Eugenie have apparently lost their police protection etc I can confirm that they still enjoy 'VIP' status. I am not sure which airport they flew from, but if they flew from any airport in the UK, I can confirm that the Princesses (as members of the BRF) would have been taken to one of the VIP lounges. They would also have received help with their luggage and would have received border privileges. [no chance of waiting by the luggage carousel and finding oneself next to Royalty!!]

Although Sarah is not a member of the BRF, I also know that it is the practice of many of the airlines she uses to accord her VIP status with regards to her flight and her luggage. [British Airways always gets their Special Services Department (i.e. for Royals and VIPs) involved from the outset when she flies, and on arrival at the airport she is whisked off to the VIP lounge pretty pronto]. I also know that when ( a few years ago) people began to question why Sarah [still] had VIP treatment, the response was that it was primarily a Security Issue. This is not just linked to madmen wanted to attack her etc but more as a way of assisting crowd control - in other words, a practical measure: imagine if word got out that Sarah was sitting in the departure lounge [she is fairly recognisable after all!!] - several aircraft-loads of waiting passengers might all rush down to stare at her.

I am therefore pretty confident that Sarah had every assitance with regard to the maintenance of her personal comfort. It may however be suiting her current 'plans' to appear forlorn. I will develop this further on the appropriate thread......

On this basis, particularly as Sarah is travelling with her daughters, I am sure that it was VIP treatment all the way.

Two other points:

One: I am not sure how VIP arrangements work in foreign countries, as I have only been involved with British arrangements, but from what I know, it is customary to grant those who have received VIP treatment at the 'British End' to be offered comparative assistance at their destination. The Times has mentioned before the Sarah enjoys privileges in the United States. Perhaps some American forum member can confirm this. Certainly I don't think I would find her in the Departure Lounge at JFK!!

Secondly: As this is a 'Bernie Ecclestone' Wedding, it is perfectly possibly that Beatrice and Eugenie [and Sarah] were flown out by Bernie Ecclestone as he has an enormous private plane [I saw it parked on the tarmac at Nice Airport a couple of years back, as he had flown in for the Monaco [auto] Grand Prix [There is no airport at Monaco, far too small; they only have a Heliport]. Most private planes leave from Luton airport or even a miliatary base west of London, and in both cases it is VIP treatment 'all the way'. With Bernie Ecclestone it is very different though - he actually OWNS an airport, Biggin Hill airport, where his planes have traditionally been based. You can therefore rest assured that Beatrice and Eugenie and their mother would have enjoyed the last word in luxury and comfort plus all the due deference that goes not only being a members of the BRF [in the case of B + E] but being the personal guests of the Top Man'. It would have been express service and red carpet treatment all the way.

I hope this helps,

Alex
 
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Eh to me she looks tired and sans makeup not that bad really.

I agree, Sarah just looks tired. Otherwise she looks no better/worse than a lot of 50+ women look without makeup.
 
I like the colour of the dresses. Sarah's is a little too tight you can see all the lines it doesn't fit properly. Beatrice looks good and Eugenie looks nice but I would have loved to see her in a colour! Looks like a huge wedding.
 
No Andrew?

Interesting, given how we've been fed a steady diet of how close and loving this divorced couple is. Well, one person says that, anyway. What better way to tell the world just how close and loving you are, than to appear together at the culmination of a romance....a wedding?

Eugenie looks tremendously wonderful. Beatrice looked like a cocktail waitress. Sarah needs to investigate Spanx.
 
No Andrew?

Maybe Andrew wasn't invited - in fact I am sure if he was invited he would have been there.

Would you want the friend of a known paedophile attending your wedding? I wouldn't - regardless of who he was - that friendship would be enough to wipe Andrew from my invitation lists and maybe others feel the same way. Who knows?

Maybe Andrew had another engagement and they decided that Sarah and the girls would go to the wedding while Andrew went elsewhere to accept some other invitation - who knows?
 
No Andrew?

Interesting, given how we've been fed a steady diet of how close and loving this divorced couple is. Well, one person says that, anyway. What better way to tell the world just how close and loving you are, than to appear together at the culmination of a romance....a wedding?

Eugenie looks tremendously wonderful. Beatrice looked like a cocktail waitress. Sarah needs to investigate Spanx.

I've never heard of Andrew really being that "into" the racing scene, neither horse nor car. Perhaps the contact with this wedding is mainly through Sarah and keeping associations she's had over the years since her Paddy McNally days so of course she and her girls would have been invited and not Andrew.

As far as Spanx, I would be willing to bet that with the dress Sarah has on, she's already wearing it and the best that money can buy. Spanx can do wonders but not miracles. Trust me on that one. :D

To be honest here, as much as Sarah has played on how close and loving she and Andrew might be as a divorced couple, I really don't think she's ever alluded to the fact that they are a "couple" again.
 
Iluvbertie;1309150Would you want the friend of a known paedophile attending your wedding? I wouldn't - regardless of who he was - that friendship would be enough to wipe Andrew from my invitation lists and maybe others feel the same way. Who knows?[/QUOTE said:
I really don't think that this would have any bearing on whether or not Andrew would have or would not have been invited. I do see your point though. That relationship has done damage to Andrew but I really don't see this wedding and the invites related to it.
 
I really don't think that this would have any bearing on whether or not Andrew would have or would not have been invited. I do see your point though. That relationship has done damage to Andrew but I really don't see this wedding and the invites related to it.

I don't see how anyone in that "peer group" bats an eye if "confronted" with the " friend of a paedophile"... If only some of the reports about the Formula 1 circus are true then there are lots and lots of really unsovoury types around, so why look down on a HRH because of his friendships?

Coming to think of it: when Fergie introduced her daughters to "society" on their coming out balls, just what kind of "society" did she introduce them to. I seem to remember that the Queen was not present but who was? Maybe Alex might be able to help, for I think this could shed an interesting light on the York family.
 
I forgot about Paddy McNally but that could explain Sarah and the girls attendance and not Andrews. Sarah got money from that same friend of Andrews so I doubt that is too much of a problem. Wow if she is really wearing spanx then that dress is just too tight it shouldn't have those lines what happens when she sits? Andrew could be in Balmoral with his family they have a family meeting each so maybe he is at that? Glad to see Beatrice boyfriend is going out with them more and more. I do love the colour of her dress, just a pity Eugenie wore black!
 
Coming to think of it: when Fergie introduced her daughters to "society" on their coming out balls, just what kind of "society" did she introduce them to. I seem to remember that the Queen was not present but who was? Maybe Alex might be able to help, for I think this could shed an interesting light on the York family.

Fergie called Beatrice's 18th her 'coming out ball' and The Queen attended that bash at Windsor Castle.

Just like her mother? | Mail Online

And Eugenie didn't have an 18th or 21st birthday to celebrate her age, they were both quiet celebrations - her 18th attended by the Queen at Windsor.
 
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