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  #121  
Old 06-20-2011, 07:27 AM
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Originally Posted by Diarist View Post
There is one thing that I cannot understand though - how can Sarah ever be construed as a 'people-pleaser'? To me, she has inflicted unquantifiable hurt on people who have been very good to her,
I think we talk different things here: you're right, Sarah has been careless or heartless enough to really hurt a lot of people, including her "nearest and dearest". But that's not the point: someone "addicted to please people" is not interested in long term relationships but loves/needs the short term "kick" of seeing someone smile and be happy because of something you've done. It's like starting your own kind of self-reward through getting good vibes from other people. People who don't interest you at all apart from the fact that they can give you those kicks. That includes (unfortunately) all kind of sales people....My, are the shop assistants happy when you spend, spend, spend...

The point is: it's short-term and does not need real efforts but buying gifts, treating people to a nice dinner etc. It's all fairly easy to achieve because you can buy this kind of short-term injection of good feelings - if you have the money. In return people thus treated pamper you a bit (staff), or react friendly (acquaintances) which gives you the feeling that your life has meaning, value and that you are loved. Which is, when all is said and done, just a cheap, superficial way to live without the need to really give something of value from yourself to others. As long as Sarah doesn't realise how this short-term good vibes system must lead to emotional crashes because nobody but your inner self can make you happy it will happen again and again. Maybe she will come to the point where she realises that in her "journey" through the Oprah-TV-Maze of consultants.


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After the marriage, I am afraid that Sarah soon started to 'show the cloven hoof', as she began to peddle interviews and photostories for £ etc. This was the point that the tabloids turned from praising Sarah to criticising her - but there is a very interesting point here even about Sarah's abilities to 'keep quiet'.
I believe as well that this was the starting point of all Sarah's unlucky fate. You don't sell access to your insider knowledge and then lie. The media does not like that going against the basic rules of the coexistence of media and celebrity (especially not from a Royal), they start to see someone as a liability and search other ways to make money out of a person's celeb status. As happened to Sarh. And she must have offended people of the Royal Staff, otherwise these paparazzi pics would never have existed. Someone must have tipped the media off. And seeing how she involved the small granddaughters of HM in her adulterous lifestyle, I personally don't wonder that some "trusted" servant seems to have become a traitor in order to stop this.
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  #122  
Old 06-20-2011, 07:56 AM
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And yet, during all these indignities, Sarah managed to keep silent...... so if she could then, in the face of almost inhuman provocation, why cannot she not 'get a grip' in public now?
Because she has no choice. She's dug herself a hole so deep and is so unwilling to admit that she's at fault that she'll do anything to avoid reality.

She's desperate for the line, "I was a Princess!", to sustain her and as long as she's got her sucker er knight in shining armor, she'll continue to live in her fantasy world.

Is it not possible that the tabloids didn't hurt her as much as she claimed? Not that she was completely unaffected but maybe, like the whole beating thing, she's playing it up.
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  #123  
Old 06-20-2011, 07:56 AM
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Certainly Sarah gave the Grey Men a field day by her behaviour...
IMHO it was the problem that suddenly there were two of those "girls" in the ranks of the Royals: Diana who had previously adopted to the way Royal life was led suddenly had a "partner or even leader in crime". Instead of playing girlish pranks in secure environments they both went public with their childish behaviour (Ascot and the umbrellas come to mind, or the interruption of a party wearing fake police uniforms). So of course they had to be informed that there are things one simply doesn't do.And I believe you are spot on with the remark that the "grey men" work for the queen and shield her from the unpleasantness to be directly responsible for the discipline within the family. A discipline she want to be followed.

I must say that I as well don't understand what made Sarah tick at that time. She must have known the "dos and don'ts" with her kind of upbringing. And still she behaved like a Princess of Monaco and not the UK....Sorry to have to say that but "vulgar" is quite up to the point.

But on another thought: it must have been quite tough coming from the world of Formula 1 and Polo to enter a court which resembles more a girl's boarding school than the hot spot of Britain's society. And that with a life sentence.... Must have been hard when Sarah realised that she wouldn't ever have a chance to become the Head Mistress of said "school" and that her "efforts" to change the rules only caused herself problems without achieving more than "peanuts" like her own country home etc. But then: she had decided to become a member of the BRF on marrying Andrew and she should have tried more to adapt.
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  #124  
Old 06-20-2011, 09:20 AM
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Originally Posted by jdcharlie View Post
I think Sarah is so lost in her little pity party because it's easier. It brings attention and enables her to cling to her fantasies. She knows that once she crawls out of the party and takes control of her life, Andrew will move on. In other words, she will be an adult, responsible for her own actions and the fantasy will officially be over.

Until such time, she gets to live in her ex-husband's house, play family with her kids and pretend that she is still part of the royal family and entitled to all its perks. I think Sarah knows what she needs to do, she just doesn't want to do it. The pity party is easier.

She needs a push into the deep end. The question is...who is willing to do it?
Here's my take and I know I am in the minority on this. I have never bought into the '" I love you you love me were a happy family" bit that Sarah has been spinning. I think her still being A guest in Andrew's house really have to do with her daughters than Sarah. She has played the victim for two decades and has sadly enlisted her daugthers in her personal woe is me party never admitting that all of this has been her doing alone. As long as she keeps saying she will be broke & homeless the girls would plead with their father to let her stay there. He knows that they would be hurt if he kicked her out so he has not. However here is where he needs to sit them down and explain a few things about life to them. These girls are no longer children but grown women. He needs to explain to them that they have all been taken advantge of & he has allowed it for way to long. Maybe as they mature in life and have romantic relationships of their own hopefully they won't allow anyone to take advantage of them & not allow themselves to be treated any kind of way because they have seen it first hand. Therefore she is using and manipulating everyone in that house to her own advantage. That's why she looked at Susie Orman like she was ready to kill her when she told Sarah that she needs to be independent for Andrew. I agree with you she ever becomes independent Andrew is going to move on with a quickness. Hopefully he is starting to do that now since the DM had an article last week about him bringing a brunette to ladies day at royal ascot last week. Correct me if I am wrong but I haven't seen him bring a date in a few years. He was also photographed with a blonde who the DM said was a former girlfriend of his so maybe there is still hope that he will finally man up and do what needs to be done and that is get her out of his house. Now that going from royalty to reality. Just my thoughts.
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  #125  
Old 06-20-2011, 12:29 PM
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As long as Sarah doesn't realise how this short-term good vibes system must lead to emotional crashes because nobody but your inner self can make you happy it will happen again and again. Maybe she will come to the point where she realises that in her "journey" through the Oprah-TV-Maze of consultants.
Actually this is what I'm hoping will happen to Sarah as this "journey" progresses. I can't say too much on the second episode of "Finding Sarah" as I found myself dozing off through most of it and missed big chunks of it. I am starting to really think that perhaps why Oprah called for some refilming of some parts of this show is because Sarah from what I have seen so far really isn't contributing too much. She seems almost like a lifeless puppet on Prozac or something. Repeating the same things over and over and doesn't really offer any real insight herself on how she can start do maybe do things differently. The part that did grab my attention was at the end of the hour where she's leaving and some people on the street seem to recognize her but not place her. She then says "I married Prince Andrew". Not "I'm Sarah Ferguson" or "I write children's books" or "I was with Weight Watchers for a long time" but relates to her relatively short marriage to a prince. This is really making me think that this entire series may actually do Sarah more harm than good as I can see it working for Sarah as part of "Brand Sarah". Instead of letting go of having her former marriage and title define who Sarah is to herself, she's just going to tack on "Friend of Oprah" and be able to name drop the various psuedo-gurus that she meets on this journey. As I've stated before, its obvious that she's still in this kind of mode after seeing interviews with her after this series was wrapped up and ready to be aired.

I supposed what I had hoped would happen for Sarah through all of this is that she would come out of it all as a more realistic person. All I see is that the "Finding Sarah - From Royalty to Reality" title should have tacked on the word TV after Reality. This is really going to seriously affect anything in the future she is going to want to do whether it be a charity, writing books, or motivational speaking. If she cannot put growth into practice on herself, no one is going to learn how to from her.

Dusting off my crystal ball, I had a glimpse of what I could picture Sarah's next business venture to be. This is just a supposition but I'd not be surprised to see it happening. There will be "Journeys" offered similar to what Sarah went through for a hefty fee. The sad thing is that there are gullible people out there that would buy into it.
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  #126  
Old 06-20-2011, 12:41 PM
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I know that I am in danger of my post being deleted, but as I promote and do PR in a medical facilty which amongst others does cosmetic oral surgery, I could not help but notice that Sarah has a frozen look on her face around her mouth muscles, it could be she suffers from TMJ problems, does anyone know? She hasn't aged gracefully, her face is so different from her younger version, strange. I actually pity her.
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  #127  
Old 06-20-2011, 12:44 PM
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OR .... maybe just a very un/healthy dose of Botox?????

ETA ... I have a close friend that has suffered from TMJ and in no way resembles a frozen look. I would stand with the Botox idea.
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  #128  
Old 06-20-2011, 01:24 PM
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OR .... maybe just a very un/healthy dose of Botox?????

ETA ... I have a close friend that has suffered from TMJ and in no way resembles a frozen look. I would stand with the Botox idea.
Be carefull, the mods don't like us members posing any "speculation" of cosmetic surgery or procedure of any kind if it has not been confirmed by the royal houses they belong to. So any frozen barbie faced, snubbed nose member of the royal family is just eating healthily, for her glowing complexion, and has only had rinoplasty, bc that's what the official statement of her royal family has announced. Uh-oh, something tells me I will be deleted...
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  #129  
Old 06-20-2011, 01:36 PM
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Forgive me, but the other thing that I find really curious is why Sarah cannot apparently control her behaviour ['addictions']. Before she had 'caught' Andrew, Sarah behaved as a model of decorum, respectfully observing protocols etc. as I have already pointed out on a different thread.
Alex
I wonder this too. For some reason, Michael Jackson comes to my mind when I think of Sarah nowadays...not that there are a lot of similarities, and I don't know that much about Michael Jackson, but he also seemed more "normal" and adult when he was a young man than when he was an older man trying to recapture his childhood. I think that when she became royal, Sarah learned that she could live off people-pleasing and her "connections", instead of forming real relationships or working for a living. Sarah is a natural communicator, and it seems like she's trying to live off her ability to talk - to spin stories about herself and her life in the royal family - because that's what she's been doing for the last couple of decades.

If any insight is coming out of this Finding Sarah series, it's that Sarah refuses to face reality. The person who posted the recap of the latest instalment of Finding Sarah (thank you!) mentioned that Dr. Phil told Sarah she was in serious denial about her life. It's interesting that, in the past, Sarah was perfectly happy to recite a list of her "bad behaviour": over-eating, over-spending, people-pleasing. She seemed very genuine and forthcoming about her "addictions", and I think this drew people to her. Interestingly, though, Sarah always left certain details out of her "story". She does mention John Bryan in her autobiography as someone she shouldn't have been hanging around with, but she never mentions her affair with Steve Wyatt, nor has she ever spoken about her affairs in public or expressed shame/guilt. It's like Steve Wyatt didn't happen. I am noticing the same pattern with the cash-for-access scandal: Sarah doesn't seem to want to acknowledge what she actually did or what she really wanted from her meeting with the "sheikh": she just complains endlessly that she was set up. That might be true, but what she did was still wrong, and it's like Sarah can't acknowledge that.

I've concluded that Sarah is eager to acknowledge some of her bad behaviour, like over-eating or people-pleasing, because they can be attributed to unconscious hurts like abandonment or a need for acceptance. She can't or won't, however, acknowledge actions she commits intentionally, probably with the full knowledge that she's doing something wrong, but thinks she'll get away with it. She has never really acknowledged her affairs or how they contributed to the breakdown of her marriage, and now, she seems to be unwilling to acknowledge that she did anything wrong in the cash-for-access sting. I think there are some things Sarah won't accept because she doesn't want to have to take responsibility and change.

One more thing...I remember that last May, after the NOWT video of Sarah and the "businessman" went public, the media was speculating on Andrew's reaction; and one paper published the story that Andrew had forgiven Sarah, felt sorry for her and thought she had been set up. It reminds me of something Sarah wrote in her autobiography - that when Andrew found out about some of the things Sarah had been doing, he thought someone had drugged her or something like that (would have to look up the details). I think that Andrew is in denial almost as much as Sarah, in that he must not want to see certain things about her...and this just plays into Sarah's hand. I think she keeps repeating that she was set-up and is consequently not responsible for her behaviour, because Andrew has told her that's what he believes.
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  #130  
Old 06-20-2011, 03:04 PM
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If any insight is coming out of this Finding Sarah series, it's that Sarah refuses to face reality. The person who posted the recap of the latest instalment of Finding Sarah (thank you!) mentioned that Dr. Phil told Sarah she was in serious denial about her life. It's interesting that, in the past, Sarah was perfectly happy to recite a list of her "bad behaviour": over-eating, over-spending, people-pleasing. She seemed very genuine and forthcoming about her "addictions", and I think this drew people to her.
I'm wondering now just how much of Sarah's admission to problems back then (and perhaps even now) were/are related to seeing her ex sister-in-law speak out about her own problems with an eating disorder and seeing the praise that she received from doing so and how people with the same problems identified with her? For someone addicted to acceptance by other people, this method would seem like the answers to all problems. For Sarah though, this kind of "celebrity down and out admissions on reality TV" type therapy is like holding an AA meeting at the corner bar over drinks. In that type of a situation they can sit over their beers and cry how alcohol has destroyed them and crashed them to rock bottom but the fact remains that until they actually stop drinking those beers, nothing is ever going to change. I think for me it boils down to that if Sarah was really serious about solving her problems and making concrete, rational changes to overcome them, they would be done on a private professional level where ratings, sales of the show and fortcoming book, and monetary gains do not figure into the picture.
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  #131  
Old 06-20-2011, 03:14 PM
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Well said, Osipi.

And all the therapy that Sarah Duchess of York may need is available freely on the British National Health system..........

Alex
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  #132  
Old 06-20-2011, 03:25 PM
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Well said, Osipi.

And all the therapy that Sarah Duchess of York may need is available freely on the British National Health system..........

Alex
I'd understand a bit of paranoia that the average psych's office might be bugged or ransacked for the info but even that could be avoided.

You have to accept that you have a problem first to seek real help and something tells me that Sarah wouldn't ever accept anything a commoner has access to. She's addicted to the fame and attention, she won't go into a private session until she's ready to actually face her demons.
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Old 06-20-2011, 03:30 PM
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That was the most disturbing thing to me about Sarah's downfall. Other things showed a lack of judgement, but exposing her young daughters to this behaviour was immoral IMO. I have the picture of Steve Wyatt with a small, naked Princess Beatrice in a book about Sarah; it really bothered me. And it was reported to have infuriated Andrew, quite rightly.

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And seeing how she involved the small granddaughters of HM in her adulterous lifestyle, I personally don't wonder that some "trusted" servant seems to have become a traitor in order to stop this.
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  #134  
Old 06-20-2011, 04:17 PM
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That was the most disturbing thing to me about Sarah's downfall. Other things showed a lack of judgement, but exposing her young daughters to this behaviour was immoral IMO. I have the picture of Steve Wyatt with a small, naked Princess Beatrice in a book about Sarah; it really bothered me. And it was reported to have infuriated Andrew, quite rightly.
I had forgotten that she had exposed her daughters. She still leeches off them for money (admitted by her) and for emotional support. What Sarah wants, she gets, and it seems in her mind why else have her daughters been put on this earth, but to take care of Sarah and make sure their royal father takes care of her as well.
I heard the line as "I am married to Prince Andrew." She also called the DOE 'my father in law first spotted that..' as if he still was her father in law. And Suzie and everyone else on the soap opera keeps insisting on calling her the duchess of york. Wouldn't it be nice if Prince Andrew did marry another woman and put Sarah firmly in her place as Sarah, duchess of york as opposed to the duchess... and I'd bet a new duchess would see her out the door as well. I wondered if Andrew showing up w/ a date at Ascot was to defuse some of the stuff coming out of the show about how close they are.
Sarah's revised take on the money for cash was that she was doing it to help a friend. And her take on her money lost from her previous ventures - it was due to mismanagement.
The interview w/ Dr. Phil was interesting, because I saw Sarah as very determined to spin things her way - and she accomplished that, getting assertive and confrontational when it suited her (no big surprise there, as Dr. P doesn't strike me as a mental giant so far.)
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  #135  
Old 06-20-2011, 04:29 PM
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I had forgotten that she had exposed her daughters. She still leeches off them for money (admitted by her) and for emotional support. What Sarah wants, she gets, and it seems in her mind why else have her daughters been put on this earth, but to take care of Sarah and make sure their royal father takes care of her as well.
I heard the line as "I am married to Prince Andrew." She also called the DOE 'my father in law first spotted that..' as if he still was her father in law. And Suzie and everyone else on the soap opera keeps insisting on calling her the duchess of york. Wouldn't it be nice if Prince Andrew did marry another woman and put Sarah firmly in her place as Sarah, duchess of york as opposed to the duchess... and I'd bet a new duchess would see her out the door as well. I wondered if Andrew showing up w/ a date at Ascot was to defuse some of the stuff coming out of the show about how close they are.
Sarah's revised take on the money for cash was that she was doing it to help a friend. And her take on her money lost from her previous ventures - it was due to mismanagement.
The interview w/ Dr. Phil was interesting, because I saw Sarah as very determined to spin things her way - and she accomplished that, getting assertive and confrontational when it suited her (no big surprise there, as Dr. P doesn't strike me as a mental giant so far.)
Actually the helping out a friend part has been pretty consistent. Though the reason why may have changed. I think originally it was to help with Uni but I'm not sure what she's spouting now.

As Andrew being seen with other women. He's done that in the past so I don't put much into as any serious girlfriend would obviously show reservations to visiting the Prince and finding his ex wife there. Marriage, to some woman of aristocratic blood I would assume, wouldn't work with Sarah in the picture unless the woman was a complete idiot or a massive social climber and/or goldigger which would make Sarah out of luck as that kind of woman would not like having competition.
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  #136  
Old 06-20-2011, 04:39 PM
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I'd understand a bit of paranoia that the average psych's office might be bugged or ransacked for the info but even that could be avoided.


I am quite sure that arrangements could be made to ensure that no bugs were present - with a 'sweep' being carried out; although I have to say that currently from a privacy point of view, Sarah does not seem unduly worried by all the public exposure her psychiatric state is getting at the moment!
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Old 06-20-2011, 04:49 PM
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I am quite sure that arrangements could be made to ensure that no bugs were present - with a 'sweep' being carried out; although I have to say that currently from a privacy point of view, Sarah does not seem unduly worried by all the public exposure her psychiatric state is getting at the moment!
This puts me in mind of a question I'd like to ask. Has there really been a lot of press (tabloid or otherwise) in the UK following this latest venture by Sarah at all? On a whim, I did a google of "Sarah Ferguson TV appearances" and it seems like she's pretty much solidly booked at least until the end of June in the NYC area. Sarah Ferguson The Duchess of York Appearances ? Schedule at Simon & Schuster. Also, I went to OWN's website to see if perhaps the video there from the show aired yesterday was closed captioned (unfortunately it wasn't) and glanced over some of the viewer's responses and they were all either glowing in admiration or seriously praising her "handlers".

I just really wondered when it was mentioned about the office being "bugged" if there is really anyone out there that would really care.
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Old 06-20-2011, 04:55 PM
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Actually the helping out a friend part has been pretty consistent. Though the reason why may have changed. I think originally it was to help with Uni but I'm not sure what she's spouting now.
I can't remember the source of the quotation, but someone once said that if you find yourself in a hole, you should stop digging.

Sarah is really in a hole at the moment and she sure is digging!

There are two issues here: Either Sarah is telling the truth and she did need the money to give to a friend to help her with 'Uni' as everyone seems to call it now or - and I hate to say it - Sarah is not telling the truth.

I am sorry, as I don't mean to Sarah-bash but why on earth would she involve herself in trying to sort out a friend's money problems, when with the greatest respect to Sarah's fans, Sarah in recent times has not been able to sort out her own money problems?

I also have to say that the sums involved are not consistent with university help - Courses are expensive now, but they don't cost £500,000+ [and didn't Sarah also tell the Sheikh that apart from the £500,000 access payment, she also wanted 'a lick of the spoon' [as she put it] from any deal that subsequently came about as a result of the 'introduction' facilitated by Sarah...? What did 'uni' need that 'lick' for?

I have to say that the whole 'helping a friend' business just does not ring true, and I am sorry to say this because I don't want to seem to Sarah-Bash. Helping a friend is a laudable thing to do, so why go behind your own staff's back - if you were genuinely wishing to help a friend, would it not have been better to have called your staff together and say 'XYZ wants to go to uni but can't afford it - can we help?' In which case the staff members should say to Sarah 'No, we can't help'.

Moreover, why did Sarah not tell the fake sheikh that she needed the money to help a friend if this was really true? It seems far more dignified rather than to say that you needed the introduction money because your own divorce settlement was 'NIL'. Which, as we know, was an untruth on the part of Sarah.

Sarah should be challenged on these assertions; that is what I find so awful about the bits I have read about the programme - there is no follow through...........

Just my opinions as usual, with no wish to offend.....
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  #139  
Old 06-20-2011, 05:06 PM
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I had forgotten that she had exposed her daughters. She still leeches off them for money (admitted by her) and for emotional support. What Sarah wants, she gets, and it seems in her mind why else have her daughters been put on this earth, but to take care of Sarah and make sure their royal father takes care of her as well.
I heard the line as "I am married to Prince Andrew." She also called the DOE 'my father in law first spotted that..' as if he still was her father in law. And Suzie and everyone else on the soap opera keeps insisting on calling her the duchess of york. Wouldn't it be nice if Prince Andrew did marry another woman and put Sarah firmly in her place as Sarah, duchess of york as opposed to the duchess... and I'd bet a new duchess would see her out the door as well. I wondered if Andrew showing up w/ a date at Ascot was to defuse some of the stuff coming out of the show about how close they are.
Sarah's revised take on the money for cash was that she was doing it to help a friend. And her take on her money lost from her previous ventures - it was due to mismanagement.
The interview w/ Dr. Phil was interesting, because I saw Sarah as very determined to spin things her way - and she accomplished that, getting assertive and confrontational when it suited her (no big surprise there, as Dr. P doesn't strike me as a mental giant so far.)
I agree with you. I was wondering why he all of a sudden showed up with a date at ascot. Maybe now he is finally reading the papers which I read somewhere he does not do & paying attention to what she has been saying in the media about the closeness of their relationship or maybe his mother just flat out told him she is making you look like a damn fool again. The little bit that I saw for her show yesterday I saw she was very confrontational toward Dr. Phil. She actually said to him well you are the genuis here tell me what you think. He said she does not want to hear what he thinks because it goes into areas she does not want to talk about. They were talking about her putting Andrew up for sale. Then what really got me was there was a small bit of her in a store in New York City shopping for hats & clothes. This from a woman who is supposed to be so close to broke. Yeah Right once again Andy has been taken for a ride but just doesn't have sense enough to get off the horse. Like you I wish he would remarry because I am sure once the relationship got serious Sarah would be out of the Royal Lodge pronto.
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  #140  
Old 06-20-2011, 05:11 PM
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........ Then what really got me was there was a small bit of her in a store in New York City shopping for hats & clothes. This from a woman who is supposed to be so close to broke. .

I can't believe it!!!! Not only is Sarah - on her own admission in the programme still 'teetering on the verge of bankruptcy' but what on earth does she she clothes and hats for? She seems to have quite enough stuff to wear......and why hats? As she is not royal, she doesn't need them for royal engagements and if there are any weddings or christenings or church services on the horizon, why doesn't she just look in her wardrobe [which is extensive] and find an existing hat to wear? [although this time, please DO NOT SPONGE OFF your daughters and borrow THAT hat!!]
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