Duties and Roles of Princesses Beatrice and Eugenie 1: Discussion Until 2022

[Lumutqueen]

William and Harry could afford it. The York girls can't.
What seemed mere high spirits in Diana's beloved sons is a chip off the old block in Fergie's daughters.
There's no comparison.

You are so right, Mirabel. It is all about image, and is not necessarily "fair." If they want to be considered working royals, they cannot afford to put a foot wrong. Fair or not, and largely because of their parents' missteps, the York princesses have serious image issues to overcome, and would have to be completely above reproach for a good long time before they will be respected and well regarded by most of the public and the BRF.

Actually those "serious image issues" belong to their parents and Beatrice and Eugenie haven't done anything the other royals haven't done.

William and Harry got away with falling out of clubs and punching the paps because they're sons of a dead beloved princess (sorry to sound crude but it's true). It is the press and people who make out B&E to be bad people or have crappy images when there is nothing wrong with their image.

Surely above anyone, their family knows that those girls have done nothing wrong and it's the failings of their parents which puts the pressure on Beatrice and Eugenie.

Beatrice gained the highest degree ever achieved by a royal this year, she parties like any royal, she attends more events than her cousins, she has a steady boyfriend who hasn't used her or sold his story to the papers.
Eugenie, studying a combined honours degree at one of this countries top universities, she parties when the occasion arises, and attends the events her sister does.

The only thing that these two have done "wrong" is the occasionally fashion mistake in my eyes. I am all for wanting Beatrice to work for her family, to live up to her title, actually i'm all for her doing something with her life. But I think it is unfair to criticise these girls when they have done nothing wrong.

 

[sliver_bic]

Actually those "serious image issues" belong to their parents and Beatrice and Eugenie haven't done anything the other royals haven't done.

William and Harry got away with falling out of clubs and punching the paps because they're sons of a dead beloved princess (sorry to sound crude but it's true). It is the press and people who make out B&E to be bad people or have crappy images when there is nothing wrong with their image.

Surely above anyone, their family knows that those girls have done nothing wrong and it's the failings of their parents which puts the pressure on Beatrice and Eugenie.

Beatrice gained the highest degree ever achieved by a royal this year, she parties like any royal, she attends more events than her cousins, she has a steady boyfriend who hasn't used her or sold his story to the papers.
Eugenie, studying a combined honours degree at one of this countries top universities, she parties when the occasion arises, and attends the events her sister does.

The only thing that these two have done "wrong" is the occasionally fashion mistake in my eyes. I am all for wanting Beatrice to work for her family, to live up to her title, actually i'm all for her doing something with her life. But I think it is unfair to criticise these girls when they have done nothing wrong.

Damn straight. As horrible as it sounds, she's treated as St. Diana. All you ever see is people commenting on Diana's boy William and comparing Kate to her. She was, and still is to some extent, a national treasure and it's bled over onto her bore (IMO) of a son and his wife.

If Sarah and Andrew had any real self-control their daughters would not be in such a predicament. They will continue to suffer because of their parents stigma as long the grown ups refuse to act like grown ups. No matter what Bea and Eug do with their lives they will be judge harshly, makes you wonder if they weren't praying for William an Harry to pop out some kids as quickly as possible to push them far enough from the throne that they'd become invisible to the tabloids.

 

[MARG]

My understanding is that it isn't the courtiers that want to cut the York princesses out from royal duties but Charles. Obviously he believes that he, his sons and his siblings can do it all but when William is King there will be William and Harry and William's children (obviously if Andrew's daughters aren't wanted then the same thing has to apply to Harry's).

But where do you get that "understanding'? It is just like "Charles wants to slim down the BRF", where does it come from?

I think we are all pretty much of a mind that the numbers game dictates the play but, can anyone produce a single quote, from a reputable source, of Prince Charles laying out the mechanics of the new, lean BRF, with particular reference to the York Princesses.

I'm beginning to wonder if Charles isn't being labelled the big bad wolf to cover for statements made by those uptight "Courtiers" that don't, and never have, liked any member of the York family. Could their personal animus be causing problems when there are none in the family dynamics?

Prince's William and Harry have always been somewhat protective of their younger cousins and still seem to enjoy their company so why would they or anyone want to, figuratively, send them to Coventry?

 

[Kataryn]

Times have changed and while in former times massive amounts of Royal engagements were needed for the people to realise their RF cared for them, today it's in fact enough when William and Catherine do something and invite the media and the TV-stations. As long it is believed that the Queen, The Prince of Wales and The Duke of Cambridge as the people on the throne/closest to the throne care for their people, the throne is secure.

So there really is no need to involve two princesses in "Royal work" when people feel they should earn their own keep through their own work. Doing Royal engagements is no longer considered to be enough once you are not directly in line for the throne, people (as represented through the media they consume) seem to feel that they should support themselves and then try to give society soemthing back in form of extra charity work. At least that's my impression.

 

[Osipi]

This discussion is bringing some thoughts to mind and I am wondering about something.

Right now we have William and Kate doing the occasional engagements with the emphasis being put on William being a full time SAR pilot. The same with Harry and his Apache training but yet still doing engagements for his patronages and things like Walking with the Wounded type projects. Although both William, Kate and Harry as children of a future monarch still have the full protection paid for by the taxpayer, at this time, they also have full time employment in the branch of the military of their choice.

With this in mind, is it not possible that this is the route that has been suggested that Beatrice and Eugenie follow? IF they were needed for certain royal engagements or did take on a patronage for the Firm, then and only on those occasions would they be provided with the protection and cost covering expenses paid for by the Crown. Working for the Firm just wouldn't be a full time way of life in the future for minor royals. Being asked to create a existence/career outside of assuming dependency on the Firm for one's income also reduces the goldfish bowl effect that so many royals have had to live in and cuts down on expenses to the taxpayers. We also have to remember that as young women, both Beatrice and Eugenie will most likely marry and wish to have a family. Being minor royals with having duties as needed, this gives both women the option of being hands on with their children and families as they grow.

 

[muriel]

This discussion is bringing some thoughts to mind and I am wondering about something.

Right now we have William and Kate doing the occasional engagements with the emphasis being put on William being a full time SAR pilot. The same with Harry and his Apache training but yet still doing engagements for his patronages and things like Walking with the Wounded type projects. Although both William, Kate and Harry as children of a future monarch still have the full protection paid for by the taxpayer, at this time, they also have full time employment in the branch of the military of their choice.

With this in mind, is it not possible that this is the route that has been suggested that Beatrice and Eugenie follow? IF they were needed for certain royal engagements or did take on a patronage for the Firm, then and only on those occasions would they be provided with the protection and cost covering expenses paid for by the Crown. Working for the Firm just wouldn't be a full time way of life in the future for minor royals. Being asked to create a existence/career outside of assuming dependency on the Firm for one's income also reduces the goldfish bowl effect that so many royals have had to live in and cuts down on expenses to the taxpayers. We also have to remember that as young women, both Beatrice and Eugenie will most likely marry and wish to have a family. Being minor royals with having duties as needed, this gives both women the option of being hands on with their children and families as they grow.

I think there are a few issues that come to my mind:

1) I cannot see a role for B&E in the BRF for the next 10-15 years. The Wales boys and their wives will pick up on the work load as the "change of generations" takes place with HM and the DoE eventually passing on, and the Kents and Gloucesters reducing their workloads as they age further. IMO, the real gap in royal "capacity" will really come when Anne, Andrew, Edward and Sophie gradually start to reduce their workloads as they age, perhaps in 10-15 years from now, and that is when the York girls can realistically expect to be called to help if the situation at the time demands. I would be surprised if they were offered meaningful roles prior to that.

2) There is also the issue of the public being ready to accept the York girls. It in unfair to judge them when they are so young and have been in full time education so far (or until very recently, as in the case of Beatrice), but I suspect if they build independent careers for themselves, achieve something for themselves, they will probably be more acceptable to the public at large. This negativity may, to some extent, be linked to their parents, but IMO, if they kept a low profile for some time and continued to develop their careers, in a decade or so they could, if required, be brought in to help the "Firm".

3) There is also the issue of allowing the girls the space and time to find their future partners, marry and bring up children before they may be called in to help the Firm.

4) I want to delink the issue of costs of protecting the York girls with the number of engagements they may or may not carry out. IMO, the issue of whether or not they need protection is not a political decision, or one for the BRF - it is solely the decision of the Home Office / the security services themselves. Those people that need protection in the view of the gorvernment should get it, irrespective of what they do - that should be the prinicpal tenet.

Just my own thoughts, your comments would be welcome.

 

[Royal_Eagle]

I think there are a few issues that come to my mind:

1) I cannot see a role for B&E in the BRF for the next 10-15 years. The Wales boys and their wives will pick up on the work load as the "change of generations" takes place with HM and the DoE eventually passing on, and the Kents and Gloucesters reducing their workloads as they age further. IMO, the real gap in royal "capacity" will really come when Anne, Andrew, Edward and Sophie gradually start to reduce their workloads as they age, perhaps in 10-15 years from now, and that is when the York girls can realistically expect to be called to help if the situation at the time demands. I would be surprised if they were offered meaningful roles prior to that.

I can see the Queen and DoE cutting back significantly over the next 5 years or so. But I think their children will continue to work full-ahead for the next 20-25 years--the oldest (PoW) is only 62, as well as the Princess Royal (61 years) can probably work another 20-30 years. The Duke of York & the Wessexes are only in their early 50s, so they can keep going for at least 25-35 years if they want to So I think to say 10 to 15 years is a bit short. Of course if they want to cut back in 10-15 years, they can, but somehow I don't see them doing that, except maybe the Duke of York.

Also a comment on what Osipi said...I don't think that any working Royals can have his/her own career in non-military fields without being accused of profiting from the Royal status. So either B&E do very little Royal work (like what the Kents and Glousters are doing and have their own careers) , or work full-time as Royal, with nothing between that. Remember that the Earl of Wessex and Countess Sophia got flak for seemingly to profit from their royal status. Maybe B&E can get away with doing very little Royal work if the Cambridges and Prince Harry have enough kids to push them down the line, although B&E will still need to be careful about their careers as they are future councellor-in-states (at the very least Beatrice).

Just some thoughts...comments are welcome of course!

 

[muriel]

Also a comment on what Osipi said...I don't think that any working Royals can have his/her own career in non-military fields without being accused of profiting from the Royal status. So either B&E do very little Royal work (like what the Kents and Glousters are doing and have their own careers) , or work full-time as Royal, with nothing between that. Remember that the Earl of Wessex and Countess Sophia got flak for seemingly to profit from their royal status. Maybe B&E can get away with doing very little Royal work if the Cambridges and Prince Harry have enough kids to push them down the line, although B&E will still need to be careful about their careers as they are future councellor-in-states (at the very least Beatrice).

I agree, mixing professional careers and royal duties can be tricky. I would therefore suggest that the York girls follow the examples of the Philips, Kent and Gloucester children and focus purely on their professional careers. That way, they will avoid any potential criticisms.

 

[Royal_Eagle]

I agree, mixing professional careers and royal duties can be tricky. I would therefore suggest that the York girls follow the examples of the Philips, Kent and Gloucester children and focus purely on their professional careers. That way, they will avoid any potential criticisms.

Indeed--I'd suggest they concentrate on their professional career and family for the next 20 years or so, then "retire" from that to help out with the Royal duties. By then, the Royal Family will probably need more help with the Queen & DoE presumably pretty much completely retired (or passed away and PoW ascending to the Throne) and the rest of the family cutting back, except for the Cambridges and Prince Harry). That way they can't be accused of profiting, etc.

At least that's how I'd do the long-term planning assuming B&E were on board with this.

 

[muriel]

Indeed--I'd suggest they concentrate on their professional career and family for the next 20 years or so, then "retire" from that to help out with the Royal duties. By then, the Royal Family will probably need more help with the Queen & DoE presumably pretty much completely retired (or passed away and PoW ascending to the Throne) and the rest of the family cutting back, except for the Cambridges and Prince Harry). That way they can't be accused of profiting, etc.

At least that's how I'd do the long-term planning assuming B&E were on board with this.

I agree with you.

 

[Al_bina]

Princess Beatrice and Princess Eugenie should focus on their careers and personal life and make rare appearances with the royal family, if they are requested to do so. People make and continue making ugly comments about them. Thus, it would be unwise for them to retire from an established way of life in 15-20 years to help the British royal family. The British royal family will not melt under a somewhat increased load.

 

[Super Baroness]

2) There is also the issue of the public being ready to accept the York girls. It in unfair to judge them when they are so young and have been in full time education so far (or until very recently, as in the case of Beatrice), but I suspect if they build independent careers for themselves, achieve something for themselves, they will probably be more acceptable to the public at large. This negativity may, to some extent, be linked to their parents, but IMO, if they kept a low profile for some time and continued to develop their careers, in a decade or so they could, if required, be brought in to help the "Firm".

I don’t understand where the idea that “the public hates the York princesses” comes from. The only consistent source (that I’ve seen anyway) that loves stirring up that pot is the Daily Mail. Every time an article about Beatrice or Eugenie in posted by the DM, people point to the comments boohooing about how “everyone” is hating on them even when they do things exemplary, like attending and graduating university. But it’s THE DAILY MAIL. They always have a very specific agenda, even with *gasp* Diana’s sons! They love to hate on Andrew and Sarah especially so of course their daughters are targets as well. It would be sad, sad world if the feelings of the general public actually coincided with the flip-floppy nature of the DM writers and commenters.

I feel like the public doesn’t even know B&E; let alone be unwilling to accept them as working royals. Their only real exposure to date would have to be at the Royal Wedding – and attention was only called to them then because their outfits were kind of terrible. Being young + being a princess = instant interest for now. But I can see them in time having a lifestyle similar to that of the Queen’s cousins.

 

[Iluvbertie]

I don't think it is realistic to expect the girls to build their own careers and then in 15 or so years turn around and say 'we need you to do some duties'.

Sorry - if they have full time careers then that is what they should do and the RF will simply have to do fewer engagements or those who are working will have to up their games.

Currently there are over 4000 engagements a year carried out by 15 royals. In 15 years time it wouldn't be unreasonable to assume that that number, by sheer rate of attrition is down to 6 - 7 with none under 40 but they will have to do the tours (take for instance the fact that in the last month the Queen and all of her children, along with Princess Alexandra, have done an overseas tour - that is half the working royal population overseas representing the country). In 15 years time many of those tours won't be happening - and as most of them are to Commonwealth countries that could have consequences for that organisation - if you believe that the royals play any real role in keeping it together.

 

[sliver_bic]

I don't think it is realistic to expect the girls to build their own careers and then in 15 or so years turn around and say 'we need you to do some duties'.

Sorry - if they have full time careers then that is what they should do and the RF will simply have to do fewer engagements or those who are working will have to up their games.

I think it's the former. The engagements will shrink with the family, people will complain but it simply won't be possible, especially for the older members to keep up their schedules. The younger "front line" royals might be able to pick up the slack but for how long? Even with the York girls it's simply not going to be possible.

I agree on it being unfair to the girls if they were asked to suddenly come back a decade or so later. Even if they had such a deal set up, would anyone fault them if marriage and children so significantly changed their lives that they wouldn't want to drop everything and go? They'll stay in the periphery for the rest of their lives but they will fade, unless something big, like a Wales death, occurs.

 

[Baroness of Books]

IMHO Princesses Beatrice and Eugenie will have to "put a foot down" with their mother in regards to royal duties. Yes they are her children, but they are no longer children. They have to accept that although their mother is still part of the York family, in a fashion, she is no longer a member of the royal family, whom they will represent when performing royal duties and that "organization" wants no public affiliation with their mother. If Princesses Beatrice and Eugenie request their mother to back off it is my opinion that Sarah will take her daughters' request to heart especially if they explain how important it is for them to perform royal duties for their grandmother. I believe that were this to occur it would gain both Princess Beatrice and Princess Eugenie a lot of confidence in their maturity, thus their abilities to perform royal duties. Once again encourage their mother that in private they'll continue to spend quality time with each other, but politely demand for her to try to not interfere with them performing royal duties. Just a thought...(well quite a few, actually)

Yes, I think the girls do need to be more assertive with their mother, hard as it may be for them since Sarah is certainly a strong character. But she'll continue to be a dominant force as long as they allow it, and they will continue to live in her shadow with her unsavory reputation tainting them, unfortunate to say, unless they do put their collective foot down. It's a hard battle and I don't envy them this situation since I'm sure they have ambivalent feelings toward their mother and her role in their lives. And who knows how much Sarah might play the sympathy card to bring pressure on the girls to get her way.

 

[Diarist]

Yes, professional careers are the only way forward, and if B and E really did concentrate on proper professional careers, something with a proper, organised career structure, then I think that all would be well and they would NOT be accused of 'cashing in' on their royal connections.

In support of this view, I invite fellow forum members to consider how profesional careers turned out for members of the Royal Family:

The Duke of Gloucester studied hard and then became an architect. He worked in partnership with other architects and he wore his royal connections very lightly. The only really outward sign of them when he was at work was his nickname 'Proggy' [= PROG = Prince Richard of Gloucester]. I suppose it would be totally naive to claim that having royal connections didn't help at some stage, but in those days, royals of his distance from the throne did manage to blend more into the background - also helped of course by the fact that the media was different back then. At the end of the day, he got his work because he was a good architect - if the buildings fell down, the fact that he was royal wouldn't have helped in the least. And he would of course have continued to practise as an archictect had his elder brother [the heir] not perished in an aircrash.

Prince Michael of Kent After Sandhurst he served in the Army [not in the Guards from memory] with several tours of duty abroad for the best part of 20 years. He was almost totally below the royal radar during that time, occasionally making the odd balcony appearance right at the end of the line, and although I presume he went to the wedding of Anne and Mark, I cannot even remember it. [In fact, he was so much in the background that reputedly Viscount Linley once had to ask 'who Michael was'!] Prince M. occasionally appeared in the tabloids when photographed with some 'eligible young gel', but this was almost always 'a photograph' rather than being accompanied by any juicy gossip - at most there would be a paragraph along the lines of 'eligble, dashing Prince Michael out on the town'. And then along came Marie-Christine von Reibnitz, rather full of herself [even though she was not entitled to call herself 'Baroness']. Prince Michael suddenly found himself dragged into the spotlight [and the centre of the BP balcony!!!] by his 'pushy' new wife, and he left the army around the time of Charles and Diana's wedding.......... Prince Michael does work hard for his charities etc, but a lot of the less than positive press comment that has been directed his way [mainly due to his 'pushy wife'] has really been due to his appearance on the Royal Scene as a perfomer of 'royal' duties....

Princess Alexandra started to train as a Nurse; in the end, this proved impractical, as she was needed to carry out royal duties - [the Duchesses of her 'generation', Kent and Gloucester, had of course not married into the BRF at that time, and Princess Anne certainly wasn't old enough to start work.] My mother's generation used to think that it was sad that Alexandra was never able to complete her training - she apparently worked well at her chosen vocation [short note: Nursing in those days was full of uppper-crust young ladies with a vocation, possibly due to the proximity of the end of the war, when many 'Society ladies' had in fact nursed, so potentially she could have had a rewarding and enduring career].

Prince Andrew served with distinction in the Royal Navy. And once he left the navy, it really all started to go wrong.....no need for further comment!

These examples above all make me see the value of proper, professional training: If Beatrice does go and intern as a stylist or personal shopper at Selfridges, I am afraid that she will always be accused of 'cashing in on her royal connections'. Apart from the fact that poor old Beatrice does not seem to have an inherent sense of style, these positions - even unpaid internships - are much sought-after and it does not help that Selfridges is owned by Galen Weston [royal friend!!]. If Beatrice does not go ahead and train for a proper, professional career, about the most that I think she 'could get away with' [i.e. without inviting undue criticism] is by making use of her history degree working in a voluntary capacity in the Royal Archives etc.

The recent 'troubles' with 'Royal Careers' has, it seems, always resulted when the 'royal' in question is really trading on his or her royal connections: take Prince Edward: his film production company required royal connections to finance it [and these investors certainly got their fingers burnt, as they lost their investment!], Sophie was really just a blonde PR secretarial girl until her royal connections convinced her that she could become an executive and Principal in her own company. And we all know what happened with that!!

Before I end, I can't avoid mentioning the Duchess of Cambridge. Much of the criticism levelled at her before her marriage was directed at the fact that she apeared to do little more that 'shop, holiday, club and party'. The Times itself cast doubt on the supposed reason for her failure to take a job - 'that she needed to be free to see William'. After adverse press comment, [centred around the irony that if William the Royal was able to fit in a career, so should his girlfriend] Catherine took a short-lived job at Jigsaw and was then apparently working for her parents [both jobs in other words 'family connected']. And she has never entirely been able to weather the 'Lazy Kate' tag, even now. Which again appears to hightlight the need for Beatrice not to use her connections to get a job......

Just my thoughts,

Alex

 

[KittyAtlanta]

Both girls are between "a rock and a hard place" when it comes to living their lives. They can't hide who they are, which is going to be a monumental obstacle into having their own careers. IMO, neither of them chose substantial subjects to study while at university. Hopefully, after a bunch of "internships" they will both pursue higher degrees in a specific profession so they can both get meaningful work. Of course, I believe they will both marry well and if that's the case, the ability to work might not be important at all.

 

[blauerengel]

These examples above all make me see the value of proper, professional training: If Beatrice does go and intern as a stylist or personal shopper at Selfridges, I am afraid that she will always be accused of 'cashing in on her royal connections'.

Thank you for summing up all the positive examples of these professionally successful royals!I also believe that a good education/training/talent will enable the young princesses to have a good career without using family connections.If they work hard and dedicate their time and efforts to something they are passionate about-wheter it may be a career or charity-I am sure that someday they will be respected and appreciated for what they are doing.
So far I only notice they are attending many charity galas or royal events
Beatrice has not received much praise for her style in the past-so I wonder if women want to hire her as a stylist and take fashion advice from her...but I could imagine she would make a good milliner because she is often wearing exceptional,excentric pieces of headgear and creating and designing could be a fulfilling job...

 

[Duke of Marmalade]

I don't think it is realistic to expect the girls to build their own careers and then in 15 or so years turn around and say 'we need you to do some duties'.

Sorry - if they have full time careers then that is what they should do and the RF will simply have to do fewer engagements or those who are working will have to up their games.

Currently there are over 4000 engagements a year carried out by 15 royals. In 15 years time it wouldn't be unreasonable to assume that that number, by sheer rate of attrition is down to 6 - 7 with none under 40 but they will have to do the tours (take for instance the fact that in the last month the Queen and all of her children, along with Princess Alexandra, have done an overseas tour - that is half the working royal population overseas representing the country). In 15 years time many of those tours won't be happening - and as most of them are to Commonwealth countries that could have consequences for that organisation - if you believe that the royals play any real role in keeping it together.

completely agree.

IMO the York girls wont have any future as key representatives of the BRF but will only be doing the odd apprearance at longstanding institutional/family events.

The institution itself will be in steady decline after QEII will be gone and it can only survive if it focuses on the core members: Charles as King & Camilla as consort, William as PoW & Kate, Harry as spare until the Wales's kids are old enough to be included.

Any other strategy IMO will be doomed and wont have public backing, the BRF will have to brace themselves after QEII & Duke are gone anyway, those two have a massive sympathy for their lifelong achievements and flawless sense of duty. After them, the knives will be out. Beatrice & Eugenie of York are the last the public want to be imposed on the monarchy, plus these two girls will forever be associated with their parents' attitude and scandals and the desastrous York image somehow sticks, fair or not.

Before I end, I can't avoid mentioning the Duchess of Cambridge. Much of the criticism levelled at her before her marriage was directed at the fact that she apeared to do little more that 'shop, holiday, club and party'. The Times itself cast doubt on the supposed reason for her failure to take a job - 'that she needed to be free to see William'. After adverse press comment, [centred around the irony that if William the Royal was able to fit in a career, so should his girlfriend] Catherine took a short-lived job at Jigsaw and was then apparently working for her parents [both jobs in other words 'family connected']. And she has never entirely been able to weather the 'Lazy Kate' tag, even now. Which again appears to hightlight the need for Beatrice not to use her connections to get a job......

Why would the tag go just like that, after the marriage. Kate hasnt done much before the wedding and hasnt done much after. But hers is a good example for the knives being out at some point, time will come when Kate is Princess of Wales (or whatever the title is) or even Queen, she will have to live up to an impossible standard, coming from the lazy tag. Times are hard for the people and they will become even harder for the royals at some point if they want to survive. To believe the BRF are there to remain forever is quite a misconception.

 

[sliver_bic]

KittyAtlanta, why exactly are History, Art History and English literature not substantial subjects? Or are you saying that they are not substantial when looking at the York's employment realistic opportunities?

Before I end, I can't avoid mentioning the Duchess of Cambridge. Much of the criticism levelled at her before her marriage was directed at the fact that she apeared to do little more that 'shop, holiday, club and party'. The Times itself cast doubt on the supposed reason for her failure to take a job - 'that she needed to be free to see William'. After adverse press comment, [centred around the irony that if William the Royal was able to fit in a career, so should his girlfriend] Catherine took a short-lived job at Jigsaw and was then apparently working for her parents [both jobs in other words 'family connected']. And she has never entirely been able to weather the 'Lazy Kate' tag, even now. Which again appears to hightlight the need for Beatrice not to use her connections to get a job......

Just my thoughts,

Alex

The thing with Kate was that many questioned whether she was actually doing any work at all. What was she doing? Laying out catalogs? Taking pictures of the merchandise? Ultimately, isn't it far better to have a real job that's gained through connections than one where people don't believe you're doing anything but laying a smoke screen while waiting to get a ring?

The Duchess has gained a lot of that Wales immunity. People falling over themselves to talk about how great she is. The York girls, it seems, will have to bite their lips and make the best of the situation, critics be damned. Over time, the criticism will wane, as long as the girls continually do an honest day's work.

 

[KittyAtlanta]

If I'm honest, I don't find those subjects substantive because everyone I have known who ended up with a liberal arts degree had a difficult time finding a job that would support them.

 

[Diarist]

.............Beatrice has not received much praise for her style in the past-so I wonder if women want to hire her as a stylist and take fashion advice from her...but I could imagine she would make a good milliner because she is often wearing exceptional,excentric pieces of headgear and creating and designing could be a fulfilling job...

A lovely idea in theory, but I forsee a problem: Generally, so far at the UK is concerned, Millinery is the same as any other fashion discipline and most people come to it from art-school Fashion training. Once you emerge from College with your degree, you have to fight your way for an apprenticehip or similar, and you 'start at the bottom' - the old-fashioned phrase was 'picking up pins for [insert name of Designer]'. Should Beatrice wish to go down this route, then I think that she would need a minimum of 3 years at art school and then probably a place on a [highly competitve] postgraduate course. And then that apprenticeship. Beatrice would have to apply NOW for the 2012/2013 Degree courses, and I reckon she would need a minimum of 5/6 years training and further work before she qualified. And I still think that she is generally perceived as having a lack of style.........

I know this is terribly old-fashioned, but I do think that if she wants a career as a royal, her best option is to marry [so ending the 'need for her to seen to work', add some charity work to her role as a wife [many rich London wives sit on charity committtees and run charity balls and fairs etc] and then she would be better positioned to slide across into performing royal duties as and when the older generation start to hand over some of their roles........

Just my thoughts,

Alex

 

[Diarist]

If I'm honest, I don't find those subjects substantive because everyone I have known who ended up with a liberal arts degree had a difficult time finding a job that would support them.

It's really quite true so far as the UK is concerned; the problem being that Beatrice's degree is NOT vocational. There is nothing wrong in 'studying-a subject-that-you-love -or-are-good-at' but it is hard to go straight into work with a non-vocational degree. Sometimes it is possibly to get a 'training' job in - for example - HR or Marketing, but you then have to work hard on the job for a qualification from the relevant professional organisation. The recession has not made things easy at the moment and a few months ago, a study showing what had happened to last year's Arts subjects graduates [i.e. basically from non Russell-Group universities] basically showed that a good few were in jobs far below their 'qualifications-level': clerical roles, waitressing, bar work etc or - even worse - on benefits. Others were, howver, training as teachers, often, it seemed, as 'something to do' rather than because they had a burning vocational desire to teach.........

Alex

 

[Al_bina]

... [snipped]
Prince Michael of Kent After Sandhurst he served in the Army [not in the Guards from memory] with several tours of duty abroad for the best part of 20 years. He was almost totally below the royal radar during that time, occasionally making the odd balcony appearance right at the end of the line, and although I presume he went to the wedding of Anne and Mark, I cannot even remember it. [In fact, he was so much in the background that reputedly Viscount Linley once had to ask 'who Michael was'!] Prince M. occasionally appeared in the tabloids when photographed with some 'eligible young gel', but this was almost always 'a photograph' rather than being accompanied by any juicy gossip - at most there would be a paragraph along the lines of 'eligble, dashing Prince Michael out on the town'. And then along came Marie-Christine von Reibnitz, rather full of herself [even though she was not entitled to call herself 'Baroness']. Prince Michael suddenly found himself dragged into the spotlight [and the centre of the BP balcony!!!] by his 'pushy' new wife, and he left the army around the time of Charles and Diana's wedding.......... Prince Michael does work hard for his charities etc, but a lot of the less than positive press comment that has been directed his way [mainly due to his 'pushy wife'] has really been due to his appearance on the Royal Scene as a perfomer of 'royal' duties.... ....[snipped]

It is always amusing to read sneering remarks aimed at Princess Michael as if she is the worst possible member of the British royal family. All was fine and well in the British royal family until her arrival. Princess Michael's transgressions are pale in comparison with dirt Prince Charles' and Prince Andrew's divorces dragged their family through.

 

[muriel]

It is always amusing to read sneering remarks aimed at Princess Michael as if she is the worst possible member of the British royal family. All was fine and well in the British royal family until her arrival. Princess Michael's transgressions are pale in comparison with dirt Prince Charles' and Prince Andrew's divorces dragged their family through.

I guess the difference is that most people in the UK appear to have moved on from the difficult times for the Wales' when their marriage broke down, and appear to be quite relaxed seeing Charles appear visibly happy in his marriage to Camilla. To me, they appear to be a lot less "relaxed" about Princess Michael and her possible transgressions.

 

[Al_bina]

British people and their a lot less "relaxed" attitude towards Princess Michael does not matter much nowadays. The bickering and parsimonious Windsor clan does enough to occupy their attention.
As for Prince Andrew's daughters, they should capitlise on their connections to find sinecures for themselves.

 

[muriel]

British people and their a lot less "relaxed" attitude towards Princess Michael does not matter much nowadays.

You are so right, Princess Michael is rather irrelevant in our lives.

However, the perception certainly is that she is exactly the type of minor royal that that brings negative attention to the royal family and strengthens the argument for a slimmed down monarchy.

I appreciate your views in relation to Prince & Princess Michael, I do hope you do not find mine offensive.

 

[muriel]

The bickering and parsimonious Windsor clan does enough to occupy their attention.

A parsimonious royal family is viewed quite positively these days. Rather be seen as tight than end up as their Russian cousins!

 

[Kataryn]

The thing with Kate was that many questioned whether she was actually doing any work at all. What was she doing? Laying out catalogs? Taking pictures of the merchandise? Ultimately, isn't it far better to have a real job that's gained through connections than one where people don't believe you're doing anything but laying a smoke screen while waiting to get a ring?

I pointed it out before but I'll do it again: in my experience, children of self-made entrepreneurs are forced by their parent's expectation to work more than others who are employed by people who are not family. Why Catherine's work wasn't more obvious? Maybe the Middletons are intelligent people who realised that bringing their daughter up-front in their business would get them headlines of "cashing in on Royal connection" through the sheer fact that Catherine was known to be William's girlfriend. So what were they to do?

 

[Kataryn]

I know this is terribly old-fashioned, but I do think that if she wants a career as a royal, her best option is to marry [so ending the 'need for her to seen to work', add some charity work to her role as a wife [many rich London wives sit on charity committtees and run charity balls and fairs etc] and then she would be better positioned to slide across into performing royal duties as and when the older generation start to hand over some of their roles........

In Germany, we have the "daughter"-term: the daughters of rich families of course pass their final exams but then decide to either stuy medicine or veterinair medicine (animal daoctor?) because they always had a horse and of course love cats and dogs. When they find out real work is involved (medicine can be quite bloody and as a vet you have to artifically inseminate cows by.... well, find out...) they search for a husband instead. There is a common saying: if you haven't found a future doctor in the third semester, you have to make it yourself... In Britain obviously you study somethin with "arts"...