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  #141  
Old 01-13-2008, 12:01 PM
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Originally Posted by Jo of Palatine View Post
I think that's at the basis fo the problem: Beatrice is most of the time portrayed as a spoiled society brat, there is nothing in the media that outbalances this image. a lot we hear from her is: I want.... ...to be an astronaut, to be a fashion designer or a mini-mummy, .... to spent my gap year in London doing nothing. We don't ever hear anything that is important for the society (except that she spends a lot of money to get the economy going).

Okay, she is young and probably is blabbing to "sources" about her dreams but why doesn't she do something worth reporting? At the moment the RF obviously has no young, shining princess, fit for a fairy tale. But the media simply waits for one. If Beatrice would give them just a little bit of that, they'd love her. To quote Richard Kay (at the Diana inquest about why the Daily Mail supported Diana): "It found in Diana someone with whom our readers identified and we were therefore quite supportive of her."

I have no doubt if readers could identify with Beatrice, they would not hesitate for a moment to support her. But who wants to identify with that girlie?
That's the Paris Hilton effect...these society girls that press follows say these big dreams to the media and then end up keeping up the same schedule: partying and doing nothing.

I'm surprised Bea hasn't brought up a trip to Darfur yet...
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  #142  
Old 01-13-2008, 12:05 PM
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Originally Posted by Jo of Palatine View Post
I think that's at the basis fo the problem: Beatrice is most of the time portrayed as a spoiled society brat, there is nothing in the media that outbalances this image. a lot we hear from her is: I want.... ...to be an astronaut, to be a fashion designer or a mini-mummy, .... to spent my gap year in London doing nothing. We don't ever hear anything that is important for the society (except that she spends a lot of money to get the economy going).

Okay, she is young and probably is blabbing to "sources" about her dreams but why doesn't she do something worth reporting? At the moment the RF obviously has no young, shining princess, fit for a fairy tale. But the media simply waits for one. If Beatrice would give them just a little bit of that, they'd love her. To quote Richard Kay (at the Diana inquest about why the Daily Mail supported Diana): "It found in Diana someone with whom our readers identified and we were therefore quite supportive of her."

I have no doubt if readers could identify with Beatrice, they would not hesitate for a moment to support her. But who wants to identify with that girlie?
Can we please criticize royals without descending to calling them unflattering terms like girlie? Jo, you write some of the most intelligent posts on this board but you do your thoughts supreme injustice by letting them mix with cheap insults like this.

Now to answer your other excellent point; I think that Beatrice is getting flak for two reasons. For readers of my age (around 40 and we are more numerous that people of Beatrice's age) Beatrice is just another sign of another young spoiled rich kid of the younger generation with no sense of propriety and sense of responsibility. That may not be a fair assessment but I think a lot of people my age do think that way about the generation that is coming of age.

On the other hand, Beatrice is likely to be judged harshly by her generation because of her lack of looks and fashion sense. She doesn't have the look and the attitude that young people think of as cool.

I don't think Beatrice can make the fairy tale princess thing happen and I really don't think she should but if she can escape her coming of age with her self esteem intact she may be able to go in the mold of Caroline Kennedy who was incredibly awkward and very uncouth when she was in high school and college but who then focused on her strengths of intelligence and kindness and set up a rewarding life for herself.
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  #143  
Old 01-13-2008, 12:45 PM
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Originally Posted by ysbel View Post
Can we please criticize royals without descending to calling them unflattering terms like girlie? Jo, you write some of the most intelligent posts on this board but you do your thoughts supreme injustice by letting them mix with cheap insults like this.
Ysbel, I'm sorry if you felt it was not okay to use a term like "girlie" for princess Beatrice, but for me it's is not an insult (though no positive comment either) but a descriptional term like "Yuppie" or "DINK" (Double Income, no kids-couples). In this case a girlie is a (young) woman with money and known family background who likes fashion but looks ridiculous most of the time in her choices, prefers partying to doing something for society and appears more often than not as kind of intellectually challenged. Talk of Paris Hilton, Nicole Richie and the likes. Or of a lot of MTV-presenters or similar young celebs. Young women who try to be seen but should IMHO neither be seen nor heard.

I'm a bit afraid she turns out a bit like her mother who is really a help- and hapless case when it comes to PR. Right now at the inquest Sarah had a statement read where she "can't recall" if she ever spoke to Diana about fears for her security. Well, IMHO that is a bad way to put it and in due note this was noticed by Michael Cole for the benefit of old Mo. If it has happened or not, she should have taken a position and either siad: no, I never did that or say: yes, I did it but..
This way she again embarrassed the RF, IMHO. And it seems young Beatrice seems to not have an idea about how to work with her image either. Just look, if someone like Britney Speasrs would talk about being "Brand Britney" she would do so on the basis that she has worked incredibly hard to come to the top from a young age. Okay, she had a breakdown now like Drew Barrymore had one or that former tennisstar Jennifer? but still she has done something to warrant the position in the public eye she now lost. While Beatrice was simply born and if she wants to take advantage of the position she was born into she should behave like a princess.
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  #144  
Old 01-13-2008, 01:14 PM
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On the other hand, Beatrice is likely to be judged harshly by her generation because of her lack of looks and fashion sense. She doesn't have the look and the attitude that young people think of as cool.
That's a good point.
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  #145  
Old 01-13-2008, 01:21 PM
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Originally Posted by Jo of Palatine View Post
Ysbel, I'm sorry if you felt it was not okay to use a term like "girlie" for princess Beatrice, but for me it's is not an insult (though no positive comment either) but a descriptional term like "Yuppie" or "DINK" (Double Income, no kids-couples). In this case a girlie is a (young) woman with money and known family background who likes fashion but looks ridiculous most of the time in her choices, prefers partying to doing something for society and appears more often than not as kind of intellectually challenged. Talk of Paris Hilton, Nicole Richie and the likes. Or of a lot of MTV-presenters or similar young celebs. Young women who try to be seen but should IMHO neither be seen nor heard.
I'm sorry Jo but the way you describe the term girlie, it does sound like an insult.

We don't want to squash negative comments about royals but we do get a lot of complaints about underhanded insults towards one royal or another so I think if you want to be critical of a royal its best to explain exactly what you mean rather than use a shorthand term like girlie.
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  #146  
Old 01-13-2008, 02:00 PM
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Originally Posted by ysbel View Post
I'm sorry Jo but the way you describe the term girlie, it does sound like an insult.

We don't want to squash negative comments about royals but we do get a lot of complaints about underhanded insults towards one royal or another so I think if you want to be critical of a royal its best to explain exactly what you mean rather than use a shorthand term like girlie.
Okay, I'll try to be good the next time.
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  #147  
Old 01-13-2008, 02:21 PM
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Okay, I'll try to be good the next time.
No problem! You're one of the most informative members around. But we do try to make the forums comfortable for the whole crowd that might be interested in royals. That's all.

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Originally Posted by Jo of Palatine View Post
I'm a bit afraid she turns out a bit like her mother who is really a help- and hapless case when it comes to PR. Right now at the inquest Sarah had a statement read where she "can't recall" if she ever spoke to Diana about fears for her security. Well, IMHO that is a bad way to put it and in due note this was noticed by Michael Cole for the benefit of old Mo. If it has happened or not, she should have taken a position and either siad: no, I never did that or say: yes, I did it but...
I missed this statement. Well all I can say is that if Sarah really didn't remember if she spoke to Diana about her security then she is safer to say so rather than make something up that she did or she didn't. I imagine that a lot of witnesses in the inquest are going to sound silly when we realize their under oath testimony sounds a lot different from what they previously said in a book or a talk show. But I can't think of any valid reason to risk perjury even if Sarah wanted to protect the royal family.

I agree with you about Beatrice's lack of understanding about PR but I'm less disturbed by it because of her age. With Sarah I think she should know better but I'm willing to give Beatrice a break for a couple of years until she gets into the work force and then I'll be more critical of her.
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  #148  
Old 01-13-2008, 02:34 PM
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I totally agree with you. There seems to be a great deal of confusion between HM private money and public tax money? I personally fail to see why HM has to account for one red cent of what she does with her private money, it is really none of anyone else's business.

If there was really an outcry in large numbers, simply stop using tax money to fund the monarchy, as you suggested.
I think this is a subject for another thread but it seems we have already a thread about the future of the British monarchy.

Is it possible for the discussion about whether the royals are worth their tax money to take place in that thread or do you members think its best to have a separate thread on whether the Brit royals are worth their tax money? Poor Beatrice is getting her thread highjacked.
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  #149  
Old 01-13-2008, 02:59 PM
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I agree with ysbel on the fact that Princess Beatrice does not have the fashion It Girl look to carry her into MTV Generation acceptance. She reminds me so much of Sarah and her awkward wardrobe choices that made her a target for ridicule.
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  #150  
Old 01-13-2008, 06:20 PM
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Originally Posted by Jo of Palatine View Post
Oh please, start pointing that out. But for obvious reasons exclude the Daily Mail, please.
All British media elements apply, you just need to take everything you read with a grain of salts, after all some of the senior royals have made some of these tabloids relevant news thanks to leaks and hearsay.

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Originally Posted by Jo of Palatine View Post
Do you really say that Camilla is a kept woman on living off her husband's purse?
why would you say she's a 'kept woman' other than in reference to her past 'mistress' title before marrying Charles in 2005?

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Originally Posted by Skydragon View Post
All the media outlets you mention, if you read them all, quote that they took their figures from the Times, whose list is compiled by a reader (retired Tim O'Donovan). If you read the UK papers, you will see that they have come around, on the whole to supporting Charles and Camilla, (apart from Kay and even he has his moments)
it must have escaped me these tremendous support the media has for Charles and Camilla. and in reference to Times poll, what makes it 'illegitimate' other than the fact supposedly Camilla and Charles are coming short? I don't know about Time O'Donovan, I would like a link on that reference. What I've read on various media is YouGov poll conducted by the Times.

William Ahead of Charles in UK Monarchy Poll: Angus Reid Global Monitor

Quote:
Prince William holds a slight advantage when Britons are asked about their preferred successor to Queen Elizabeth II, according to a poll by YouGov released by the Sunday Times. 42 per cent of respondents would like William to become the next king, while 36 per cent choose Prince Charles.
Here is a recent poll done by Discovery Channel:

Prince William favoured as next monarch | UK | Reuters
New crisis for Prince Charles as it emerges majority of Brits want William for king | the Daily Mail

anyway, let's get back to what this thread was about, Princesses Beatrice and Eugenie's duties or lack thereof at the moment.

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Andrew is seen by a lot of UK residents as unimportant, except for the fact that he misuses his position and the money he is given. One minute you are quoting the headlines to prove your case, even though you then go on to say it is all relative. Polls can never be indicative of the UK public as I am sure you are aware!
Is that your own conducted polling or do you refer to some evidence within public opinions based on sources you can post? Its one thing to state ones personal opinion, its another to provide absolute answers in a royal forum where its about suppositions and gossip media.

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Camilla has visited the troops on many occasions without the fanfare that Andrew requires. Camilla's visits were as Camilla, who happens to be The Duchess of Cornwall, totally informal. Andrew, Anne and even Charles have only visited in their official capacity and no, to my knowledge and heavy involvement in two arms of the services, HM has very rarely written to and never visited the injured soldiers or bereaved in their own homes! Again to my knowledge, nobody in Andrews regiments, when injured, has received a letter from him or a member of his staff.
so giving direct support and doing your royal duty is considered 'fanfare'? Was Prince Philip visiting the troops last year in Afghanistan 'a fanfare'? If all the senior royals conducted their royal engagements in private or informally, there would be little purpose for the Monarchy since most people and government would wonder what they do all year.

lastly, if Camilla does as much for the troops as you claim, why hasn't any of the military divisions publish as they usually do when any officials public figures visits them. After all there is nothing informal when Camilla as a member of the royal family visits or writes to the troops, she has to do it via CH office, use official Prince of Wales recognized letters. One would think her 'lazy' image would be smashed by CH public relations machine, to show her dedication.

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Andrew was born into his job and the UK public can expect more from him and his sibling, Edward. We can certainly expect better behaviour from his daughters if he is intent on them keeping their HRH.
that we can agree on and in my opinion he's doing a good job as a senior royal and his daughters have few more years to establish their place within the royal family. I would expect much more from William and Harry than a 19 and 17 yrs teenagers. They seem to be decent private young ladies living their lives amidst the intense media attention.
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  #151  
Old 01-13-2008, 07:06 PM
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Originally Posted by Lamyah View Post
it must have escaped me these tremendous support the media has for Charles and Camilla. and in reference to Times poll, what makes it 'illegitimate' other than the fact supposedly Camilla and Charles are coming short? I don't know about Time O'Donovan, I would like a link on that reference. What I've read on various media is YouGov poll conducted by the Times.
We were I believe discussing the work load report that you quoted. - Royal Insight > April 2006 > Mailbox > Page 2 - as you will see, the figures do not include, audiences, Investitures or overseas engagements. The Times online page under the search Royal Engagements in 2007 will not load at the moment, but as you can see, the official site lists his amateur report. - Mr Tim O'Donovan, a member of the public, logs the engagements undertaken by each member of the Royal Family during the calendar year; these are obtained from the Court Circular pages in certain national newspapers. The figures are then totalled and the results are published on the letters page of The Times at the beginning of each year, providing a set of unofficial statistics.

I would also point out that Yougov conducts the polls for various newsgroups, not the other way around.
Quote:
Here is a recent poll done by Discovery Channel:
Two polls (if you check although you have posted three, two quote the same source), and a total of how many out of the entire population of the British Isles?
Quote:
Is that your own conducted polling or do you refer to some evidence within public opinions based on sources you can post? Its one thing to state ones personal opinion, its another to provide absolute answers in a royal forum where its about suppositions and gossip media.
Read the Andrew thread and of course all the comments on here from people from the UK. There are many articles within the media that condemn Andrews lack of effort, very many of them posted in the Andrew threads. If you are still having trouble reading them, let me know by PM and I'll send you all the links. I would also add that among my friends and my childrens friends, I have been unable to find anyone who thinks Andrew is doing a good job and is worthy of an HRH.
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so giving direct support and doing your royal duty is considered 'fanfare'? Was Prince Philip visiting the troops last year in Afghanistan 'a fanfare'? If all the senior royals conducted their royal engagements in private or informally, there would be little purpose for the Monarchy since most people and government would wonder what they do all year.
Whilst fanfare has it's place, many soldiers returning injured or the bereaved wives, mothers, daughters do not want that sort of thing. Being paraded for the camera's, many are appreciative of the personal touch of a private visit to their bedside or home. Contrary to the belief of some, the majority of the armed forces in Iraq or Afghanistan do not want or appreciate a visit from a royal or politician. With their visit comes extra danger to the men and in the majority of cases, the 'men' are taken to the plane to meet the royal, so that the royal doesn't have to walk too far to greet the men. They are too busy trying to stay alive to want to 'f*nny about' over a royal. They are also ordered to smile and wave, although many do in the hope that their relatives might see them.
Quote:
lastly, if Camilla does as much for the troops as you claim, why hasn't any of the military divisions publish as they usually do when any officials public figures visits them.
Because Camilla has the sense, as an ex army wife to know that the men and the wives don't want to share their worries, injuries and grief with a camera lens or a newspaper. The visits are purely on a private basis, for the good of the men and women she meets, not to bulk up her image.
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that we can agree on and in my opinion he's doing a good job as a senior royal and his daughters have few more years to establish their place within the royal family.
No we cannot agree that Andrew does a good job, nor do his daughters, whatever their age.

The best bet for Andrew and his daughters, IMO, is to lose the HRH and fade into obscurity in America.
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  #152  
Old 01-13-2008, 07:25 PM
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The best bet for Andrew and his daughters, IMO, is to lose the HRH and fade into obscurity in America.
...tell us how you really feel.
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  #153  
Old 01-13-2008, 07:28 PM
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But she's right. She's always right. And I mean that.
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  #154  
Old 01-13-2008, 11:55 PM
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Princess Eugenie can't be fairly included in this "problem". Princess Beatrice alone seems to suffer from the confused distinction between royalty and celebrity. Princess Eugenie, to my awareness, has not, of yet, shown any dangerous leanings.

Perhaps despite my "better" judgement (whatever that means) I like these princesses. I hope they find how to be themselves and make positive contributions to the world.
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  #155  
Old 01-14-2008, 03:20 AM
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Originally Posted by Skydragon View Post
We were I believe discussing the work load report that you quoted. - Royal Insight > April 2006 > Mailbox > Page 2 - as you will see, the figures do not include, audiences, Investitures or overseas engagements. The Times online page under the search Royal Engagements in 2007 will not load at the moment, but as you can see, the official site lists his amateur report. - Mr Tim O'Donovan, a member of the public, logs the engagements undertaken by each member of the Royal Family during the calendar year; these are obtained from the Court Circular pages in certain national newspapers. The figures are then totalled and the results are published on the letters page of The Times at the beginning of each year, providing a set of unofficial statistics.
The statement that Tim O'Donovan's figures do not include audiences, investitures of overseas engagements is not correct. He is quite thorough in his gathering of data. He just doesn't just give a number of engagements but actually breaks it up into, dinners, meetings, overseas engagements, investitures, audiences, openings. This year he stated that the Queen had fewer overseas engagements but more within Britain. That 75% of Andrew's overseas engagements were due to his role with Trade and investment ( the other 25% were things like attending Malaysia's 50th anniversary of Independence, the Thai king's birthday, visiting regiments in Canada)

He also uses just The Times to gather his information, the Court Circular which The Times has printed for 200 years. The information in the Court Circular comes directly from The Palace, so we can assume it's accurate.
His statistics are unofficial as he's a private person who just does it for a hobby, he's not employed by any statistic gathering organisation or the Palace. Anyone can verify his data if they have the time to sit down with a year's worth of The Times newspapers and are prepared to trawl through The Court Circular.

Clarence House does release official figures that include not only the public engagements that are listed in The Court Circular but also private engagements. The information released includes things such as how many letters Charles ( and now Camilla) received, how many they personally replied to. Clarence Houses releasing this kind of information is to try and counteract the negative things written about Charles ( and now Camilla) and their workload. Buckingham Palace do not release the same kind of information for the Queen, DoE, Anne, Andrew etc. But that doesn't mean that they too don't equally spend a comparable amount of time 'working behind the scenes'

I agree that Andrew doesn't have a good public image in the UK, but then again neither did Anne in the 1980's it took years, ( the 1990's) when she would year after year appear near the top of Mr O'Donovan's figures. ( Not the top that was always Prince Philip, it's only recently due to his age that his workload had reduced) Andrew has just begun, it will take a number of years before he will be given any credit for the work he does. The whole 'playing golf while on Trade business' is an outdated criticism, it goes back years, there have been no such stories ( as he hasn't done it, if he had it would be on the front pages of the tabloids so easy to verify!) for the past few years. It's just an easy thing to hang onto to criticise Andrew just like Camilla is criticised for being workshy over some 'attributed comment from a 'friend' or Charles and criticism for his talking to plants and being a 'looney'. Tabloid journalism isn't of the high intellectual variety and will hang onto the stereotypes they develop.

Andrew didn't do a lot of royal engagements in the past as from the age of 19 he was a fulltime naval officer, so it's somewhat unfair to criticise him for being workshy even from before he met Sarah ( who as a royal carried out quite an impressive amount of public engagements, again can be verified. Diana actually never did, it was just that hers got the most publicity so it seemed as though she did a lot. Probably something that really irked Anne who was doing double the engagements of Diana and getting a tenth of the publicity)

It's easy to criticise Beatrice but as Elspeth pointed out, she's the grand-daughter of a monarch, and as such she will carry out some duties but will also have a worklife away from royal duties. A more equal comparison would be with the Belgian royals, the children of Princess Astrid, also grandchildren of a monarch and around the same age as Beatrice, they have carried out no royal duties, none at all and Princess Astrid receives money from the Belgian tax payer.

Charles did not start fulltime royal duties until he was 27 and had left the navy. Anne did not start until after she had children ( early 30's) she was in serious training as an equestrian, once she retired she got pregnant with her son and then Zara. Edward as we know tried to set up his own business, it failed and in his late 30's he became a fulltime royal. Andrew retired from the navy at 42 to become a fulltime royal. The expectation that Beatrice will become a fulltime royal at 19 isn't realistic especially as there are a number of fulltime royals at the moment.
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  #156  
Old 01-14-2008, 04:18 AM
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Originally Posted by Lamyah View Post
A
why would you say she's a 'kept woman' other than in reference to her past 'mistress' title before marrying Charles in 2005?
.
I only reacted to your saying that Camilla has "yet to earn her keep", that says IMHO that she is a kept woman. So I had the impression that this was your opinion and was curious why you would say this when Camilla is married to the man who pays for her keep...
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  #157  
Old 01-14-2008, 04:26 AM
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If Beatrice is not going onto further education then, perhaps, she could "shadow" her Aunt Anne or Princess Alexandra and learn what a true working Princess should be doing.
I shudder when I see pictures of her partying with the likes of Peaches Geldof!
Mind you, how much work does Princess Madelaine do?????
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  #158  
Old 01-14-2008, 04:32 AM
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Originally Posted by Skydragon View Post
The best bet for Andrew and his daughters, IMO, is to lose the HRH and fade into obscurity in America.
I guess once the princesses marry, they will follow the example of Princess Patricia of Connaught (a grand-daughter of queen Victoria) who on her marriage relinquished formally her title and style of princess and HRH to become simply Lady Patricia Ramsay. And then there was HRH princess Katherine of Greece and Denmark who asked the then king Georg VI. on her marriage to relinquish her Royal title and was created Lady Katherine Brandram with the precedence of a duke's daughter.

I believe the difference to Princess Alexandra, Lady Ogilvy was that she had already proven that she has been an asset to the Royal family and the British public when she got married, so she kept her HRH in order to go on working for "the firm".
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  #159  
Old 01-14-2008, 06:55 AM
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Originally Posted by Charlotte1 View Post
The statement that Tim O'Donovan's figures do not include audiences, investitures of overseas engagements is not correct. --SNIPPED__
The quote was from the government site, not a personal quote. It is also worth mentioning I feel that this was last years list
Quote:
--SNIPPED-- That 75% of Andrew's overseas engagements were due to his role with Trade and investment ( the other 25% were things like attending Malaysia's 50th anniversary of Independence, the Thai king's birthday, visiting regiments in Canada)
Which just goes to show that he does not need the HRH and the extra money he gets. Can you imagine the CEO of a top company getting away with so few business meetings or events?
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I agree that Andrew doesn't have a good public image in the UK, but then again neither did Anne in the 1980's it took years, ( the 1990's) when she would year after year appear near the top of Mr O'Donovan's figures. ( Not the top that was always Prince Philip, it's only recently due to his age that his workload had reduced) Andrew has just begun, it will take a number of years before he will be given any credit for the work he does.--SNIPPED--
Andrew didn't do a lot of royal engagements in the past as from the age of 19 he was a fulltime naval officer, so it's somewhat unfair to criticise him for being workshy even from before he met Sarah ( who as a royal carried out quite an impressive amount of public engagements, again can be verified. Diana actually never did, it was just that hers got the most publicity so it seemed as though she did a lot. ---SNIPPED
I havn't said a great deal about his navy days, now he is constantly seen as workshy. He only does what he can't get out of IMO. He simply can't sit back and say 'I was in the navy, I fought in the Falklands', give me a medal'. Many of the men who fought at that time, came back, were binned out by the MOD (not Andrew though), had to find accomodation and jobs. Just because he was in the navy umpteen years ago, doesn't entitle him to anything. He has got a bad reputation in the UK, he rarely makes the papers here, so as he doesn't seem to 'rock the boat' of the UK taxpayers, is it right that we should continue to pay him a salary. What HM does with the money she is given, is up to her but it is no good asking for more for the upkeep of the royal homes, when she could save a bit by insisting that Sarah and Andrew pay for the security, if they think it is needed, for their daughters. Eugenie as everyone says is still at school, Beatrice is doing nothing except party and holiday, probably paid for as a claimable expense. I genuinly can't see a role for her once William and Harry marry, she is more popular in the states than she is here. IMO.

Someone was asking for poll results about Andrew and his daughters, there are none, (as a member of YouGov, Mori, I did a search) simply because they are not considered important to the monarchy.
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Old 01-14-2008, 07:41 AM
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Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Sydney, Australia
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Originally Posted by Skydragon View Post
The quote was from the government site, not a personal quote. It is also worth mentioning I feel that this was last years listWhich just goes to show that he does not need the HRH and the extra money he gets. Can you imagine the CEO of a top company getting away with so few business meetings or events?
The government site royal.co.uk, the Insight mailbag often has errors in it. Tim O'Donovan for a long time, not just this year has broken down exactly what type of public engagements the royals have done.

Andrew has done 556 public engagements, ( which is more than Charles, The Queen, the DoE, Edward etc, only Anne has done more) for each business trip he does he has briefings this was not counted in his public engagements since they're not listed in the Court Circular. Unless one has actually seen his diary then to condemn him for doing little is unfair.

He's currently on a Trade and Investment trip to Egypt, from where he travels to Abu Dhabi and finally to the US, all within the next month. The British Trade and Investment Board would not be using him the way they are if they didn't think what he was doing was worthwhile. The contrast is that the post he holds was previously held by the Duke of Kent, he was very much a figurehead and didn't attend the trade functions that Andrew does. If Andrew wasn't much use then he too would have been shunted off as a figurehead, good on the notepaper but not involved in meetings, addressing foreign audiences, or attending trade functions overseas.

I don't think that either Andrew or his daughters will ever have a high profile, eventually Beatrice and Eugenie will have the same kind of role that Princess Alexandra has, a few public engagements a month and be paid from the Civil list allowance that the monarch receives. Currently Alexandra, and the Duke of Kent carry out a few public engagements ( the Duke more than Alexandra) most people would have no idea but they're still doing it. Same with the Duke and Duchess of Gloucestor ( more than the Kents) and all of them are paid from QEII's Civil List allowance like Andrew, Edward and Sophie.
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