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  #1101  
Old 11-12-2011, 11:01 PM
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Hear, Hear!!! As much as I like the newer recruits to the BRF, it can't hurt to have another couple of fresh faces on the team.

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To be honest, these girls are in the public eye, they are normal, surprisingly well-adjusted young women who are an asset to the BRF. Why not use them?
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  #1102  
Old 11-13-2011, 05:55 AM
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It really is a case of wait and see. It's is up to Charles in the end as he will be the one paying for them. As for their careers who said they have any plans on being career women? They may do what a lot of girls do in their position work for awhile then get married and have a family. They can afford too. So far Bea hasn't shown any real interest in doing charity work on her own because I'm certain it would be leaked and used to show her in a better light then just out partying all the time. The way Sarah always manages to talk about the girls she would have said something, I don't think she could help herself. Plus it puts a good light on her. Doing one marathon run and selling a silly hat doesn't show a huge passion to me. Many people do that run and they do it every year and they raise money for charities and work full time as well that shows commitment. Whatever it is Bea is going to do it doesn't look like she is going to start until next year after her annual ski trip. As most places don't generally start people this close to Christmas. I also think that since this theory that Charles doesn't want them to be fulltime working Royals has been around for awhile I can't believe that no one bothered to tell Bea and Eugenie so they should have chosen their courses and thought about what else they want to do. Of course we do have Andrew pushing for them but I see that as him wanting them to have the perks and lifestyle more then them having a huge passion for charity work. Maybe in time we will get to hear more about the 'plan" for the Royal family for the future. Time will tell but we should know something in the next couple of months at least where Bea does her first of her many internships.
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  #1103  
Old 11-14-2011, 11:18 AM
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It seems I am way outnumbered on this forum, but I still think that, until the York princesses prove they are to be taken seriously by being above reproach in their personal lives and using good judgment about appearances with their mother (i.e., no more appearances like the one on Oprah or accepting invitations to participate in Euro rich-trash events, etc.), the BRF and their advisors will not want them officially representing the family.
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  #1104  
Old 11-14-2011, 11:54 AM
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I agree with you Susanna
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  #1105  
Old 11-14-2011, 01:33 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PrincessKaimi View Post
..............
You don't have to DO anything to end up with a poor image in the public mind. Sometimes it's what you don't do - and it's often ineffable. Some people have charisma (William) and others do not. William and Harry are both benefited by the mana shed by their mother,..............
William and Harry certainly benefit from the affection in which people held their mother, and of course this has been magnified by the fact that Diana died tragically at a young age, which is very good for the 'sympathy' vote as well, but what the two Princes have over the two Princesses is the fact that both William and Harry are serving in the Forces. in other words, they are percieved to be working in a tough job, whereas - however unfair it might seem - Beatrice has not yet got a job [however good her reason may be] and Eugenie, although at Univesity and therefore precluded from full tme work is - however unfairly it may seem - is still being painted as a clubbing-and-holidaying person in her free time.

Alex
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  #1106  
Old 11-14-2011, 01:37 PM
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Originally Posted by Mermaid1962 View Post
After Catherine became engaged and wound down her involvement with her parents' company, they advertised for a director of marketing. Presumably then, that's what she was doing.

A very logical conclusion, Mermaid, but apparently not. The job advert did attract comment at the time, and the specialist marketing press made it clear that it was a different role entirely - full time, need for experience, IoM Certificate etc. I can remember reading that Catherine's job involved photography, was 'part time'e etc and seemed to be rather nebulous as well in my humble opinion.

Only my thoughs,

Alex
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  #1107  
Old 11-14-2011, 02:20 PM
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Please could I help with a little information about some of what Lumutqueen has said?

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Originally Posted by Lumutqueen View Post
I'd just like to say that as far as clothes, car hire and drinks go Beatrice and Eugenie as with probably every other 'younger' royal is bound to get them for free or for a significantly reduced prize. If a Princess wears a designers dress, that designer is pretty much guaranteed to reap the benefits. Look at Catherine, a royal nobody, and she's praised as a fashion icon because the clothes she wears sell out in seconds.
I cannot speak for Beatrice and Eugenie, but so far as most Royals are concerned, they do NOT 'get freebies' - they are NOT allowed to accept them. The Times' fashion correspondent and Vogue have, over the years, made the point that members of the Royal Family pay for what they wear, although there has always been speculation that some sort of 'special rate' is allowed.

Princess Michael of Kent according to London gossip over years does get free clothes; she was rumoured to be in receipt of 'freebies' from Roberto Devorik [London-based Argentininan fashion entrepreneur], ditto Gianfranco Ferre when he was alive. Princess Michael herself also mentioned to a journalist that she had a relative who worked for the Parisian fashion house of Nina Ricci, who also helped her access clothes to borrow as well as keep. Whether this is true or not we don't know.

So far as Fergie is concerned, during her marriage, her staff approached a number of designers looking for freebies. One of these, Zandra Rhodes, actually was quoted in the press turning the request down with the immortal words ' Darling, I don't need the bad publicity'. [This unkind-sounding remark has to be placed in the context of the times - Sarah was being roundly criticised for her wardrobe and indeed her figure, at that time]




Quote:
Originally Posted by Lumutqueen View Post
Quick point, a degree from Goldsmiths or Newcastle particularly a 2:1 in Beatrice and Eugenie's fields are just as could as an oxbridge degree.
However unfair it might seem, I don't think this is actually true. I went to Oxford, and however unfair it sounds - and indeed snobbish -, believe you me, it opened doors for me in a way that a degree from Goldsmiths never could have done. Like I said, it is very unfair, and the actual quality of the degree is probably not that different in theory, but in practice, there is a world of difference. It's a good few years since I was job hunting, but any Oxbridge graduate is exposed to a recruiting process that most other university students could only dream about. Newcastle is a 'better' university in theory [whatever 'better' really means] than Goldsmith's, because it is a Russell Group [a bit like 'Ivy League] University and Goldsmiths is not. It may be nasty, narrow-minded and uinfair, but I am afraid that most employers, faced with identical CVs stating 'Goldsmiths' or 'Oxbridge' would almost always go for the Oxbridge candidate.

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Originally Posted by Lumutqueen View Post
Peter Phillips as a practical private citizen was IMO right to take the Hello! publication deal, and it was a good thing to see the BRF sweat over their public image they so often hide.
In my humble opinion, Peter Phillips was NOT right to take the money. He might be a private citizen, but his wedding was peopled with Royal relatives and if he had had nothing but 'private [i.e.' unknowns'] citizens' at his wedding, no magazine would have wanted to pay him for his nuptuals. This is why B and E are going to be in a 'no win' situation if they are not careful - i.e. they could fall between two stools, being both 'royal' (albeit without defined royal roles), which would make it hard to classify them as private citizens.

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Originally Posted by Lumutqueen View Post
Beatrice and Eugenie have a trust fund, it is theirs to use as they wish and when they wish

A nice idea, Lumutqueen, but we actually do not know this. Under English law, Trusts are private and the terms of the trust are governed by a Trust Deed, which is a private legal instrument. Generally, there are two elements to a trust, income and capital. There are very often restrictions on the use of both income and capital. It is common with some trusts to prevent the beneficiaries accessing the capital until they are 25 years old or so. We don't know what the terms of Beatrice and Eugenie's trusts are. There may well be strict clauses about use of the money - athough thanks to Sarah, we know that apparently the restrictions on the use of trust income were lax enough to allow Sarah to 'leech' [as the papers put it] off her daughters' trust funds. I believe Lord_Royal is a solicitor; perhaps he could help us with English Trust law if he drops by here.

Hope some of this helps,

Alex
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  #1108  
Old 11-14-2011, 02:30 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Diarist View Post
I cannot speak for Beatrice and Eugenie, but so far as most Royals are concerned, they do NOT 'get freebies' - they are NOT allowed to accept them. The Times' fashion correspondent and Vogue have, over the years, made the point that members of the Royal Family pay for what they wear, although there has always been speculation that some sort of 'special rate' is allowed.
Oh yeah of course, that's the official line.

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Originally Posted by Diarist View Post
I am afraid that most employers, faced with identical CVs stating 'Goldsmiths' or 'Oxbridge' would almost always go for the Oxbridge candidate.
I'm not sure when you went to Oxford, but trust me i've done my research on university's and what I wrote it pretty damn accurate. The past, is the past.


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Originally Posted by Diarist View Post
In my humble opinion, Peter Phillips was NOT right to take the money.
Your opinion of course, but as I said not one I agree with.


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Originally Posted by Diarist View Post
A nice idea, Lumutqueen, but we actually do not know this.
You may not know this yes you are right in saying that. But my point still stands, whatever trust fund B&E have received or shall receive can be used as they wish at their discretion.

That's just my information, on what you wrote.
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  #1109  
Old 11-14-2011, 02:38 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Susanna Wynne View Post
It seems I am way outnumbered on this forum, but I still think that, until the York princesses prove they are to be taken seriously by being above reproach in their personal lives and using good judgment about appearances with their mother (i.e., no more appearances like the one on Oprah or accepting invitations to participate in Euro rich-trash events, etc.), the BRF and their advisors will not want them officially representing the family.

I think that your post says it all, Susanna. I am absolutely sure you are right; unless and until the Princesses put aside all their dubious conections etc they are not going to find it easy to make a case for being included as 'perfoming members' of the BRF. Case in point: at the moment, the UK is being treated to a goodly deal of scandal courtesy of Mr Bernie Ecclestone. This,er, gentleman is busily giving evidence in court about the enormous financial bribe he has paid to third party. By this admission, he could well find himself facing criminal charges. And a good few articles about Bernie at the moment mention his daughter's wedding ...............and Beatrice and Eugenie. Not the fault of the two young princesses at all, but their association with an apparently less-than wholesome-person can only impactd negatively on the girls' own image............
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  #1110  
Old 11-14-2011, 02:41 PM
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On the contrary, Lumutqueen, Oxbridge degrees occupy the top of the firmament in the UK and the world. A recent top level survey included Cambridge and Oxford in the top ten universities in the world along with Harvard, Yale, Stanford and several other top flight US institutions. The only other university outside of the US on this stellar list is the University of Tokyo. As an academic, I know that the University of London is a fine institution (Goldsmith's being one of the U of L colleges, along with the London School of Economics), but it is not Oxbridge. And that exists today and not just in the past. I am very familiar with the way hiring goes and a Harvard, Yale, Oxford or Cambridge degree will trump just about anything else anywhere in the world.
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  #1111  
Old 11-14-2011, 02:43 PM
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Let's not stray from the topic of the thread.....duties of Beatrice and Eugenie.
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  #1112  
Old 11-14-2011, 02:53 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lumutqueen View Post
I'm not sure when you went to Oxford, but trust me i've done my research on university's and what I wrote it pretty damn accurate. The past, is the past.
A good few years ago, Lumutqueen. But I can tell you this, Oxbridge employment figures today for new graduates are far, far higher than for overall non-oxbridge graduates. That's a fact. Indeed, even today, one of my old employers still automatically bins non-Oxbridge applications. Snobbish and shortsighted in my opinion, as it may well be cutting out a good pool of talent, but an Oxbridge degree is seen as better by most 'blue chip' companies than Goldsmiths. Beatrice - and in due course Eugenie - are always going to be at an advantage because of their royal connections, but even Beatrice's 2:1 degree would not help many 'lesser mortals' without experience at the moment.....

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Originally Posted by Lumutqueen View Post
You may not know this yes you are right in saying that. But my point still stands, whatever trust fund B&E have received or shall receive can be used as they wish at their discretion.
Only insofar as the terms of the trust allow this. And this is law, not discretion........
.
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  #1113  
Old 11-21-2011, 05:20 AM
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Royal divide over role for Princesses | Mail Online
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  #1114  
Old 11-21-2011, 07:55 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Susanna Wynne View Post
On the contrary, Lumutqueen, Oxbridge degrees occupy the top of the firmament in the UK and the world. A recent top level survey included Cambridge and Oxford in the top ten universities in the world along with Harvard, Yale, Stanford and several other top flight US institutions. The only other university outside of the US on this stellar list is the University of Tokyo. As an academic, I know that the University of London is a fine institution (Goldsmith's being one of the U of L colleges, along with the London School of Economics), but it is not Oxbridge. And that exists today and not just in the past. I am very familiar with the way hiring goes and a Harvard, Yale, Oxford or Cambridge degree will trump just about anything else anywhere in the world.
Quite right, this is not a matter of personal opinion, it is a fact.
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  #1115  
Old 11-21-2011, 09:03 AM
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Originally Posted by Lumutqueen View Post

At least Charles and Andrew are discussing it.
I forget where, but I did read that Beatrice has been very disappointed that she may not be a working Royal.

I still say she should be given a chance: a few engagements, with strict orders to keep Mummy far far away.
See how she conducts herself before kicking her to the curb. If it doesn't work out, her first appearance can be her last.

I actually think her taste in hats is an asset; it's raised her profile to the point where she's instantly recognizable! If I were Beatrice, I'd wear an outlandish hat on every possible occasion to raise my profile even further. That way people will look forward to seeing her.
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  #1116  
Old 11-21-2011, 09:29 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lumutqueen View Post
Nice pic of the princesses. Plus a positive comment on the Duchess of Cornwall by Richard Kay. Why this?
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  #1117  
Old 11-21-2011, 09:36 AM
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Honestly, I don't think he is saying anything that hasn't been discussed here or in the Daily Mail before.

Looks like he 1) had some space to fill in his columns and couldn't find out any other dirt) and/or 2) its been ahwile since the ususal nastiness was said about the York Princesses so why not write an article that says nothing and is about nothing and call it day.

And as usual, the regular DM contributors have nothing nice to say about them. I wonder if any of them live beyond reproach and if they would like it if THEIR children were judge by THEIR actions.

Probably not.
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  #1118  
Old 11-21-2011, 10:48 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lumutqueen View Post
IMHO the role that Princess Alexandra of Kent has served during her cousin's the Queen's reign should serve as the model for the roles of Princesses Beatrice and Eugenie beginning now under their grandmother's reign and continue during their uncle's and cousin's reigns.
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Old 11-21-2011, 12:33 PM
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That's a bad article. Bad, bad, bad. It may be true, but it doesn't need publishing. Pitting Charles and Andrew is very bad form. I, personally, do not think either princess is worried about what they are going to "do."

As for that remark about Chelsea Clinton being in the news all the time...well, maybe somewhere, but not in her own country. Chelsea, apart from her ghastly, expensive wedding, has never been news fodder.
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  #1120  
Old 11-21-2011, 02:11 PM
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I actually think her taste in hats is an asset; it's raised her profile to the point where she's instantly recognizable! If I were Beatrice, I'd wear an outlandish hat on every possible occasion to raise my profile even further. That way people will look forward to seeing her.
Actually, that could work. After every engagement she can auction them off for charity.
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