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  #1061  
Old 11-09-2011, 10:30 PM
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After Catherine became engaged and wound down her involvement with her parents' company, they advertised for a director of marketing. Presumably then, that's what she was doing.

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The thing with Kate was that many questioned whether she was actually doing any work at all. What was she doing? Laying out catalogs? Taking pictures of the merchandise?
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  #1062  
Old 11-09-2011, 10:44 PM
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If I'm honest, I don't find those subjects substantive because everyone I have known who ended up with a liberal arts degree had a difficult time finding a job that would support them.

I've had the same experience. In fact, I've lived the same experience!

But I don't say the main problem is that those degrees are not substantive; I think it's because they are so popular! So many many people take those degrees, and the plum jobs simply can't go around.

But I want to be honest too; those degrees are easy! It's far easier to complete a degree in English, imo, than one in biophysics!
But the jobs are harder to come by, because of the huge competition.

Of course Beatrice won't have that problem; because of her connections, she can easily get one of those sought-after positions, and simply ignore any criticism. I think that's much the best thing she could do.
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  #1063  
Old 11-09-2011, 11:25 PM
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Exactly, a liberal arts degree is not a specialized one; because it's in the humanities it's very broad and very popular, but certainly substantial. I had the same situation and experience as well, so even though obtaining a degree in English or history may be easier than in the sciences (some may disagree, especially when it comes to writing papers), it was really difficult finding a job because of all the liberal arts majors competing for the same positions.

In Beatrice's case, she's damned if she does and damned if she doesn't. If she has an advantage with her connections, she may as well use it for a well-placed job. She'll be criticized anyway, no matter what course she takes. And who knows how many of the other royals, like Lady Helen Taylor, used their royal connections for their positions? We probably don't hear about it because they're not high profile.
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  #1064  
Old 11-09-2011, 11:48 PM
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Sorry but it is horses for courses. Most Science graduates couldn't do an humanities degrees because they don't have the writing skills etc to do it just as most humanities people would struggle with a Science degree. In fact there are a number people of my acquaintance who have degrees in both who say that the humanities (History) degree was far harder - for them.

To diss a person because of their degree is rather sad in my opinion.

Beatrice not only has a degree and a good one at that - a 2.1 - she also has a noted learning disability and should be praised for that.
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  #1065  
Old 11-09-2011, 11:56 PM
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To me, the fact that Beatrice got a good degree while coping with dyslexia shows that she's a hard-working and determined young lady.

There seems to be an assumption that because Beatrice isn't seen about much in the daytime that this indicates that she isn't doing anything other than living the high life. In reality, we don't know what she does during the day. She could be sitting around watching DVDs or she could be building up to something big.

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Beatrice not only has a degree and a good one at that - a 2.1 - she also has a noted learning disability and should be praised for that.
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  #1066  
Old 11-10-2011, 12:11 AM
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Originally Posted by Iluvbertie View Post
Sorry but it is horses for courses. Most Science graduates couldn't do an humanities degrees because they don't have the writing skills etc to do it just as most humanities people would struggle with a Science degree. In fact there are a number people of my acquaintance who have degrees in both who say that the humanities (History) degree was far harder - for them.

To diss a person because of their degree is rather sad in my opinion.

Beatrice not only has a degree and a good one at that - a 2.1 - she also has a noted learning disability and should be praised for that.
Exactly, it all depends on what side of the fence you're sitting. I have a degree in English lit and excelled in writing but was dismal at math and science, while many of my acquaintances in those latter fields were brilliant but didn't have good writing skills. I didn't think any less of them, and was confident the feeling was mutual.

I applaud Beatrice for being one of the few royals to obtain a college degree, working through a disability to get it, and hopes she puts it to good use.
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  #1067  
Old 11-10-2011, 12:33 AM
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This topic of duties and roles has become awfully vague. Supposedly, it has been insinuated that their uncle the Prince of Wales will reduce the number of royal duties performed by his relatives when he becomes king. It is assumed that included in this group of relatives are Princess Beatrice and her younger sister Princess Eugenie. As a result it is recommended that their uncle should not or will not provide them with the financial support to sustain a certain quality of life. Also it is recommended that their grandmother expedite this scenario by ceasing all current financial support immediately. An alternative means of support for the princesses would include income earned via employment in a certain profession. Flaunting their status as royals has been put forward as a strategy to facilitate acquiring a position. The culmination of such actions including a stellar performance in their chosen professions will in turn improve their acceptability amongst the public. Does this sum it up?

Why is it assumed that the Prince of Wales won't allow his nieces to perform royal duties? Do their performance of royal duties have anything to do with their quality of life? What kind of "professional" career does one suggest for a royal princess? If they were to seek private employment, would it be ethical for the princesses to exploit their royal status?
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  #1068  
Old 11-10-2011, 12:53 AM
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Average people go and start working because they want to be financially independent and their parents tell them to move out at a certain age.Most of the people I know started with work they didn´t enjoy much because they wanted to make some money while they were training to get the career they were passionate about.
I suggested arts because it is a relatively "free" business and you can even make a career without a degree if you have a lot of talent and work hard.People like Karl Lagerfeld or Jean Paul Gaultier don´t hold a degree from a well-known university/college but are among the most influental designers of our time.Being successful in fashion and art is a lot about good networking and being able to deliver what the general public wants to see.It doesn´t matter if you were the best at Central Saint Martins College of Art and Design if nobody likes your creations.
I don´t believe that marriage and charity will be a fulfilling job for the York Princesses.Most of these "trophy wives" who marry rich men and have no own career or special cause end up desperate,bored and frustrated...
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  #1069  
Old 11-10-2011, 09:26 AM
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Originally Posted by blauerengel View Post
I suggested arts because it is a relatively "free" business and you can even make a career without a degree if you have a lot of talent and work hard.People like Karl Lagerfeld or Jean Paul Gaultier don´t hold a degree from a well-known university/college but are among the most influental designers of our time.Being successful in fashion and art is a lot about good networking and being able to deliver what the general public wants to see.It doesn´t matter if you were the best at Central Saint Martins College of Art and Design if nobody likes your creations.

Fashion is a terribly competitive field; I could even describe it as cut-throat.
I can't imagine Beatrice doing well there, unless it's as a sort of figurehead.

When Caroline Kennedy finished school, she initially took a job at the Metropolitan Museum in New York.
There was some criticism of course (other candidates were better qualified) but it quickly died down and she continued working there.

Beatrice can use her status to find a niche like that; since it truly isn't a business, she can't be accused of using her title to profit.
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  #1070  
Old 11-10-2011, 10:36 AM
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To sum up: here are the main problems the York girls face in pursuing their father's dream of having them be serious working royals:

1. Sarah, Andrew, Sarah, Sarah Sarah

2. Too much partying, too many photos of one or the other falling out of nightclubs* and a history of unfortunate clothing choices which has now morphed into the wearing of extremely expensive designers (read Elie Saab, Vivienne Westwood, etc).**

3. Sarah, Andrew, Sarah, Sarah, Sarah.

Fairness, sadly, has nothing to do with it. Perception, in our telegenic world, is EVERYTHING -- and the York girls must understand this and behave accordingly.

*Note that it is unfortunate and unfair (for us members of the female sex) but girls look much worse than boys after a night of overindulging. Kate understood that and always took care not to drink too much and to "fix her face" before facing the inevitable photographers after a night at Boujiis. Good sense goes a long way...

**Kate's practice of mixing high street style with the occasional touch of designer has gone a long way to reinforce the perception of good sense that she is more and more widely accorded.
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  #1071  
Old 11-10-2011, 10:45 AM
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Yes, Caroline Kennedy did work at the Met, but she went on to further education in the law.
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  #1072  
Old 11-10-2011, 11:03 AM
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The girls won't need to work to support themselves. They have trust funds. I'm sure they will receive more when their grandparents pass. If they end up being working royals, they will receive money for their offices, just like current working royals do. The civil list (which is covered by the Queen) is not a salary for the royal - but an amount to cover working expenses.
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  #1073  
Old 11-10-2011, 11:23 AM
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Originally Posted by KittyAtlanta View Post
Yes, Caroline Kennedy did work at the Met, but she went on to further education in the law.

True; her situation was a bit different than Beatrice's.

I only meant this same type of job, which Beatrice could easily get through her connections, wouldn't be one where she'd be accused to cashing in to make a profit, since the employer would have non-profit status.
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  #1074  
Old 11-10-2011, 11:27 AM
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Originally Posted by KittyAtlanta View Post
Yes, Caroline Kennedy did work at the Met, but she went on to further education in the law.
As well as having a degree in Fine Arts from Harvard. She was most definitely qualified for the job she received.

It would be the equivalent of Beatrice working as a researcher for a prominent British historian or educating at say a national Historical Site. Something directly related to the degree.

N.B. This isn't me saying that Beatrice should only work in those examples but just adding more context to the Caroline Kennedy analogy.
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  #1075  
Old 11-10-2011, 11:35 AM
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As well as having a degree in Fine Arts from Harvard. She was most definitely qualified for the job she received.
Perhaps, but not as qualified as some of the other applicants at the time, who had not only the required degree, but also experience in the field.

Let's face it, if she'd been Caroline Smith, she wouldn't have gotten the job.

(This is not to say she didn't do well in the position, just that it was her name that got her in the door).
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  #1076  
Old 11-10-2011, 11:38 AM
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^^^^
In my experience most people end up working in fields that have little to do with what they studied at university unless they have a more vocational degree such as accounting or engineering. Liberal arts degrees expose you to a wide range of subjects beyond your core area which makes one quite adaptable. One of the purposes of a degree is to prove your ability to learn, not to say that you studied history so that is all you are capable of doing for your entire life.
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  #1077  
Old 11-10-2011, 12:21 PM
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In short, image is everything in the business they're in.
Indeed, so what have these girls done to damage their image that other royals haven't exactly?
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  #1078  
Old 11-10-2011, 12:25 PM
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^^^^
In my experience most people end up working in fields that have little to do with what they studied at university unless they have a more vocational degree such as accounting or engineering. Liberal arts degrees expose you to a wide range of subjects beyond your core area which makes one quite adaptable. One of the purposes of a degree is to prove your ability to learn, not to say that you studied history so that is all you are capable of doing for your entire life.
That was my point. Perhaps it wasn't well articulated but I was saying that people can't assume just because Beatrice wouldn't want to work in a stuffy researcher's office (?, don't know they're "place of work") that she used her name to surpass those who have degrees in fashion, etc. in getting a job.

To be completely honest it's currently a cut-throat environment in absolutely every line of work now a days. It should be assumed that everyone with the littlest connections will be using them to get a job, without any of the unfavourable reactions that Beatrice is receiving. Thank you GFC!
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  #1079  
Old 11-10-2011, 12:46 PM
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... [snipped] That would be so ridiculously sad if they simply quit life like that. Unless, of course, it's who they actually are. They'd still be sad but it'd be pathetic instead of unfortunate.
It would be naive to assume that Princess Beatrice's and Princess Eugenie' positions within the British caste system have no influence on their future employment opportunities. It would be much easier for them to land plum jobs than extra bright Mr. or Ms. XXX.
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  #1080  
Old 11-10-2011, 12:56 PM
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Indeed, so what have these girls done to damage their image that other royals haven't exactly?
Image is in the minds of people - so you'd have to ask all the people who think they have a poor image. I certainly have no real idea - but people throughout this thread have suggested that Sarah and Andrew have something to do with it, as well as other factors.

You don't have to DO anything to end up with a poor image in the public mind. Sometimes it's what you don't do - and it's often ineffable. Some people have charisma (William) and others do not. William and Harry are both benefited by the mana shed by their mother, which still descends upon them, especially William as I hear people say "oh, he looks so much like his mother, look at that smile," in a swooning tone of voice. I do not know why people react the way they do to other people. It's like falling in love - you either do or you don't.

But what the object of our affections DOES is often not the whole of it.
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