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  #1001  
Old 10-29-2011, 09:33 PM
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Originally Posted by Iluvbertie View Post
What people have to realise is that in reducing the size of the working royal family they will also be reducing the number of engagements by a considerable number as well e.g. currently they carry out over 4000 engagements a year with 15 working royals but as that number will be reduced under Charles to about 6 - 8 then the number of engagements will also have to be reduced to about 2000 and the small hospitals and military units etc will simply not have any royal visits. Tours will also have to be shorter or many countries that get a visit now about once every 4 years like Australia will have to settle for once every 8 years (and Canade down to every 4 years instead of every 2 years as now)
And- there will be massive screaming about it, from the public sector!

Wait and see- everyone is all for cutting down on the size of the RF- until it results in these cutbacks, and then the complaints will be heard.
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  #1002  
Old 10-29-2011, 10:22 PM
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Yes, I agree. I wonder, though, how many people are for cutting back on the Royal Family, really. People like to see overall costs cut (particularly those who think that the taxpayers bear the cost of every little thing), but do they really want fewer working royals?

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Wait and see- everyone is all for cutting down on the size of the RF- until it results in these cutbacks, and then the complaints will be heard.
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  #1003  
Old 10-30-2011, 12:31 AM
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As far as the major Commonwealth nations, they have been covered by the senior royals: The Queen, D o E, P o W, Pr. Wm and Harry. So I suspect they will continue to be paid quite a lot of attention and from the same list, adding in the D o Cornwall and the D of Cambridge as well. Lesser royals wouldn't be asked to handle such high priority engagements, even if they were in greater favor.
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  #1004  
Old 10-30-2011, 02:09 AM
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Princess Anne is currently touring Ghana and Sierra Leone - countries that the 'big star' royals don't visit.

What will happen if the big guns of the royal family are to continue their current attention to Australia, Canada etc is that countries like Ghana and Sierra Leone won't get a royal visit at all.

You can't have it both ways. The big guns can't do all the major tours and all the minor tours as well as all the other things on their own - and that means compromises - smaller countries not have royal visits at all (quick way to lose more kingdoms) or the bigger countries having fewer visits (again a quick to say - not interested in us so we aren't interested in having you).

These are the sorts of tours that Beatrice and Eugenie could be undertaking for King William but as they are being told - you aren't wanted - back luck William and Kate will have to do a lot more.
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  #1005  
Old 10-30-2011, 03:08 AM
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They may not be counting on Australia as a future Monarchy country. The republic issue has been bandied about for a long time. Most seem to be waiting for the Queen to pass on to really put into a action. That will be one country less to worry about! Do the lesser Royals do smaller tours? Anne is the Queens daughter and has done many of these tours for her charity. Doesn't it depend on what charity work the girls do? I think if people want a smaller Monarchy then they will have to accept fewer visits and less charities supported. They can't have it both ways. I would hope that the RF and the powers that be are working out a system. Of course not everyone is happy but then they aren't now either.
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  #1006  
Old 10-30-2011, 04:28 AM
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Did you read the piece by Graham Richardson in yesterday's Daily Telegraph Republicans bow to the Queen's charm | thetelegraph.com.au

This avowed republican says we might get a chance under Charles but that William is unassailable.
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  #1007  
Old 10-30-2011, 09:25 AM
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Originally Posted by Iluvbertie View Post
Did you read the piece by Graham Richardson in yesterday's Daily Telegraph Republicans bow to the Queen's charm | thetelegraph.com.au

This avowed republican says we might get a chance under Charles but that William is unassailable.

It's a rather silly article, though; the Queen is determined to hang on so her grandson gets the job??
As if any of us has any control over how long we live!!!
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  #1008  
Old 10-30-2011, 10:41 AM
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We may get visits by senior royal quite frequently, but also regular shorter visits as well. The Duke of York, The Wessexes, The Princess Royal and to a lesser extent the Kents are all regular visitors to Canada. They are involved with numerous organizations here.
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  #1009  
Old 10-30-2011, 06:46 PM
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There will be fewer senior members of the BRF, though. The Princess Royal will be 81 in 20 years, and Prince Charles and The Duchess of Cornwall will be 83 (Camilla's a bit older, I think). The Cambridges will be almost 50, and their children likely wouldn't have started royal engagements and likely won't until they finish university. The Wessexes will still be active, but they'll be getting close to 70 years old, and their children likely won't be doing royal engagements at all. If the Duke of York remains healthy (unmarried men tend to die earlier), he'll be in his early 70s. So I think that that Beatrice and Eugenie will be needed, and perhaps sooner than we envision.

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Originally Posted by yvr girl View Post
We may get visits by senior royal quite frequently, but also regular shorter visits as well. The Duke of York, The Wessexes, The Princess Royal and to a lesser extent the Kents are all regular visitors to Canada. They are involved with numerous organizations here.
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  #1010  
Old 10-30-2011, 07:03 PM
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The York princesses WILL be needed. Any courtier who thinks otherwise has his or her head in the sand. It's going to come down to a numbers game and the generation gap. As well, if you cut the number of public appearances substantially The Firm is going to be viewed as extremely lazy and lose relevance.

Canada, Australia and the smaller Commonwealth nations all need a regular Royal presence. Canada receives the lions share of Royal visits and their popularity there is tremendous. There isn't one of them who isn't liked, even the controversial ones are forgiven their transgressions (Prince Phillip's a "straight shooter"...Princess Michael of Kent is "ultra fabulous"...Sarah, Duchess of York is "Fergie, that feisty redhead") so the York girls would be welcome in Canada, their father visits the Canadian province of Ontario regularly, as does their mother, always to positive news coverage.

I think both York princesses have tremendous potential. Fergie simply needs managing, which is absolutely possible through a variety of means (I will forever be convinced that her trip to Thailand during the Cambridge wedding was palace dictated).

The York princesses would be best placed in areas that 1) are welcoming to their mother (ie Canada and the United States) 2) smaller and off the beaten royal track (ie where The Princess Royal is dispatched to).
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  #1011  
Old 10-31-2011, 04:19 AM
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My understanding is that it isn't the courtiers that want to cut the York princesses out from royal duties but Charles. Obviously he believes that he, his sons and his siblings can do it all but when William is King there will be William and Harry and William's children (obviously if Andrew's daughters aren't wanted then the same thing has to apply to Harry's).
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  #1012  
Old 11-05-2011, 08:54 AM
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Originally Posted by Iluvbertie View Post
My understanding is that it isn't the courtiers that want to cut the York princesses out from royal duties but Charles. Obviously he believes that he, his sons and his siblings can do it all but when William is King there will be William and Harry and William's children (obviously if Andrew's daughters aren't wanted then the same thing has to apply to Harry's).

But Charles will probably take advice from courtiers; he is known for polling his advisors when he makes decisions.

And really, Lord Royal is right; there's simply no way Charles and his family can keep up with the demand for a royal presence once the older generation is gone. To cut back is sure to cause resentment. Besides, Charles, Camilla, and Anne are already in their sixties. So who's left?
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  #1013  
Old 11-05-2011, 09:18 AM
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But Charles will probably take advice from courtiers; he is known for polling his advisors when he makes decisions.
yes i know this , but maybe he not like advice in last & listen for him self
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  #1014  
Old 11-05-2011, 10:29 AM
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I still believe that, despite the number of patronages wanting/needing to be filled, if these girls do not present a truly good and wholesome image, and their mother continues to be seen to be overly influencing them, the powers that be (Charles and his advisors) will not want them in any official or semi official roles where they could cast any further tinge on the BRF. And it won't have anything to do with whether they can be charming and endearing on a specific engagement (they surely can and do), it will be about how they live and what they do with the rest of their lives.
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  #1015  
Old 11-05-2011, 08:14 PM
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Originally Posted by Susanna Wynne View Post
I still believe that, despite the number of patronages wanting/needing to be filled, if these girls do not present a truly good and wholesome image, and their mother continues to be seen to be overly influencing them, the powers that be (Charles and his advisors) will not want them in any official or semi official roles where they could cast any further tinge on the BRF. And it won't have anything to do with whether they can be charming and endearing on a specific engagement (they surely can and do), it will be about how they live and what they do with the rest of their lives.

I understand your point about their mother but what on earth has caused the comment 'do not present a truly good and wholesome image'?

Unless being young and enjoying their university years is the negative image. Afterall at the same ages Harry and William were regularly seen coming out of clubs drunk at night.
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  #1016  
Old 11-05-2011, 08:26 PM
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Originally Posted by Iluvbertie View Post
My understanding is that it isn't the courtiers that want to cut the York princesses out from royal duties but Charles. Obviously he believes that he, his sons and his siblings can do it all but when William is King there will be William and Harry and William's children (obviously if Andrew's daughters aren't wanted then the same thing has to apply to Harry's).
Can't the girls get "normal" jobs and still do charity work? Why does it have to be either this or that. With this arrangement they could probably satisfy most people.
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  #1017  
Old 11-05-2011, 08:37 PM
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Agree with you jemagre. Getting a "normal job" and still doing charity work will probably be the norm in 20 years for most royals.
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  #1018  
Old 11-05-2011, 09:43 PM
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Originally Posted by Iluvbertie View Post
I understand your point about their mother but what on earth has caused the comment 'do not present a truly good and wholesome image'?

Unless being young and enjoying their university years is the negative image. Afterall at the same ages Harry and William were regularly seen coming out of clubs drunk at night.

William and Harry could afford it. The York girls can't.
What seemed mere high spirits in Diana's beloved sons is a chip off the old block in Fergie's daughters.
There's no comparison.
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  #1019  
Old 11-05-2011, 10:47 PM
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You are so right, Mirabel. It is all about image, and is not necessarily "fair." If they want to be considered working royals, they cannot afford to put a foot wrong. Fair or not, and largely because of their parents' missteps, the York princesses have serious image issues to overcome, and would have to be completely above reproach for a good long time before they will be respected and well regarded by most of the public and the BRF.
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  #1020  
Old 11-07-2011, 02:24 PM
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I think that both William and Harry tend to be forgiven their excesses because they are both serving Officers in the Forces. In other words, they are seen to be doing a relatively tough job that is pretty demanding at times.

I also think that Diana's untimely death also will always mean that there is a residual sympathy for the boys.

Image is indeed sometimes unfair. But it's the old 'perception is reality' concept again.

However unfair it might seem, Beatrice and Eugenie are seen about holidaying and partying a fair amount of time. Beatrice has not yet either taken a job or be seen to have a consistent plan of voluntary or charity service. The fact that she has only recently left university is only slightly in her favour; the bottom line is that - regardless of recessions etc - Princesses are meant to be seen to work. Beatrice is very much better educated that Diana was, but even the latter [with a pretty solid financial foundation behind her as well] was seen to be occupying her time pre-Charles in an constructive way - teaching assistant at the Young England Kindergarten, nannying etc. Beatrice has to be seen to be doing something because 1. She is Royal 2 She has the advantage of a university education 3. However unfair it may seem, she has to counteract the 'party girl' image and also the unfortunate 'image' of her mother, 'Freebie Fergie with all her other attendant foibles. It makes poor Beatrice a target, but if you have the advantages of having been born royal, you have to put up with the disadvantages as well...

Just my thoughts,

Alex
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