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  #781  
Old 05-17-2011, 02:47 AM
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Originally Posted by Vasillisos Markos View Post
So Charles's wish for the future of the royal family is partly based on public perception and economics, and partly based on him not being that close to his younger brothers? I guess that makes sense -- sort of like a family held corporation reducing the board of managers in order to save costs.

That is certainly how I see the situation but other members may have other theories or interpretations or understanding of the motives for Charles.

As he has never stated his reasons publicly we are really speculating as to why he thinks this way but public perception would be a very good reason - particularly when this was first muted in the late 90s in the post Diana anti-monarchy upsurge (even though it wasn't all that big an upsurge it was still there).
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  #782  
Old 05-17-2011, 05:10 AM
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rmay I COMPLETELY AGREE WITH YOU. Start "shrinking" the monarchy, demoting HRH's to Mr/Miss/Mrs and what do you have??

I am all for a cutback on ostentation in times of economic hardship, but let's face it...either you want a ROYAL family or a Republic.
I would be surprised of Charles stripped B&E of their titles. They may not have a public role in the BRF, but I suspect they will keep their titles.

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BTW...I like and admire the Prince of Wales but his desire for "cutbacks" only seem to apply to other members of the family and not ever himself. Just like the late Queen Mother, he leads an extremely luxurious lifestyle and stubbornly refuses to give up any of his perks.
Charles' lifestyle is funded entirely by his private finances, and those of the Duchy of Cornwall. He probably does not feel the need to explain to anybody how he spends his own money.


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He reportedly wanted the Earl of Wessex to move out of Bagshot Park because the estate is so huge and costly
Bagshot Park is a very large estate, and as pointed out by IluvBertie, it is likely that the lifestyle of Wessex family is subsidised by his parents. It may well be that Charles may not want those arrangements to continue once he becomes King, and may therefore want the Wessex family to move to premesis a bit more in keeping with their finances and their position with the BRF.


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...but meanwhile he himself only travels by Rolls Royce and throws glittering dinner parties at Highgrove and Clarence House with no cost spared.
Actually, Charles usually travels in an Audi A8 or a Jaguar XJ. The Rolls (which was made in 1977) is typically only used for ceremonial use, or when carrying out public engagements in the evening.
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  #783  
Old 05-17-2011, 10:43 AM
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Charles must realize what the result of all this "downsizing" in order to appease the public suspicion that they are all moochers?

There is always the risk that the ones who are going to be out looking for "real" jobs are going to be associating with some very shady characters in their search for lucrative work.

Worst case scenario are reality series, talk shows, etc which I am sure is not going to help the image of the Monarchy at all.

So Charles-and perhaps Williams-plans to downsize in order to make the Monarchy more streamlined and appealing to the public could backfire in a major way.

ETA: I know that any monies from the Duchies are his to spend as he pleases...but the blunt fact is that Charles only has access to that money because of a lucky accident of birth...he is heir to the Throne.

It is not the fault of Edward, Anne and Andrew that they were not lucky enough to be born in that position...and they are extremely limited in the type of work they can seek to support themselves adequately as are the Kents and the Gloucesters.
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Old 05-17-2011, 11:25 AM
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Originally Posted by Moonmaiden23 View Post
Charles must realize what the result of all this "downsizing" in order to appease the public suspicion that they are all moochers?

There is always the risk that the ones who are going to be out looking for "real" jobs are going to be associating with some very shady characters in their search for lucrative work.

Worst case scenario are reality series, talk shows, etc which I am sure is not going to help the image of the Monarchy at all.

So Charles-and perhaps Williams-plans to downsize in order to make the Monarchy more streamlined and appealing to the public could backfire in a major way.
Anne's children have all built careers for themselves, and should not be a concern. The Wessex family and the York family probably have been provided for financially by HM, though the York girls will be the one to most watch. I am sure Charles and William will just have to keep them on a short leash. Nothing (but they themselves) stops these girls from building careers for themselves. There are no real restrictions on what they may want to do, unless they very specifically want to pursue careers in PR or parts of the media where they could well be perceived conflicts. They could become journalists, teachers, lawyers..... whatecver they like. David Linley (in a position similar to the York girls) seems to have managed to stay out of trouble. Similarly, I hope the Wessex children grow up to have independent careers for themselves as well.


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ETA: I know that any monies from the Duchies are his to spend as he pleases...but the blunt fact is that Charles only has access to that money because of a lucky accident of birth...he is heir to the Throne.

It is not the fault of Edward, Anne and Andrew that they were not lucky enough to be born in that position...and they are extremely limited in the type of work they can seek to support themselves adequately as are the Kents and the Gloucesters.
Quite right, it is true that it is an accident of birth, just as becoming the monarch is. That however does not prevent him from spending his money the way he wants to.

Edward, Anne and Andrew are not required to go out and support themselves financially, HM provides for them, and will no doubt leave enough money for them to live in the manner to which they are accustomed. Similarly, I am sure funding will be in place for the other grand children of HM, including Harry, Zara, Peter, Louise, James, B & E. I suspect it will be for them to decide how they want to spend their money, though the provisions of the trust deeds will be in the private domain.
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  #785  
Old 05-17-2011, 01:52 PM
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muriel, I had forgotten about trust funds and you are quite right.

Even if they are required to make their own careers in the near future, none of HM's grandchildren will ever be worrying about how they are going to pay their phone bill or put food on the table.

The Queen is said to be a very wealthy woman and has shown herself to be more than generous to members of her family.
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  #786  
Old 05-17-2011, 05:30 PM
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Originally Posted by muriel View Post
Anne's children have all built careers for themselves, and should not be a concern. The Wessex family and the York family probably have been provided for financially by HM, though the York girls will be the one to most watch. I am sure Charles and William will just have to keep them on a short leash. Nothing (but they themselves) stops these girls from building careers for themselves. There are no real restrictions on what they may want to do, unless they very specifically want to pursue careers in PR or parts of the media where they could well be perceived conflicts. They could become journalists, teachers, lawyers..... whatecver they like. David Linley (in a position similar to the York girls) seems to have managed to stay out of trouble. Similarly, I hope the Wessex children grow up to have independent careers for themselves as well.
The RF can't have it both ways - they either have the younger royals working for the firm or they have to take the consequences of the careers they choose for themselves.

If the argument is that they are cutting down the size of the royal family and thus cutting costs to the taxpayers - fewer engagements and fewer royals equals less need for security and thus less cost to the taxpayers - but the other side is that the younger family members also have to be free to do their own thing.

If Beatrice wants to run a TV show on the most outrageous costumes worn to public events then she should be able to do that if she isn't going to be a working member of the family and the family would have to accept that as they have told her - get a career.



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Quite right, it is true that it is an accident of birth, just as becoming the monarch is. That however does not prevent him from spending his money the way he wants to.
This is no different to the eldest son and heir to any of the great estates e.g. Earl Spencer inherited far greater wealth than his sisters but nobody complains about the way he spends his money and yet his family came by that estate in much the same way as Charles got his - being born to the right parents and having ancestors who were more brutal than the next bloke.

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Edward, Anne and Andrew are not required to go out and support themselves financially, HM provides for them, and will no doubt leave enough money for them to live in the manner to which they are accustomed. Similarly, I am sure funding will be in place for the other grand children of HM, including Harry, Zara, Peter, Louise, James, B & E. I suspect it will be for them to decide how they want to spend their money, though the provisions of the trust deeds will be in the private domain.
We don't know, and never will know, how much the Queen leaves her younger children but on past experience she will leave them comfortable.

If we look back to the grandchildren of George V - they are comfortable but their children have to work so the money doesn't last forever.

I would expect that the Queen will leave very little to Harry as he will inherit more from Charles and also has a large inheritance from his mother and thus will have less need of a large inheritance from the Queen. I wouldn't be surprised if she only has trust funds for her three children and leaves them to provide for their own children although she might have a trust fund for all her grandchildren and even for Savannah - but that raises the issue of fairness for later great-grandchildren - does she also say that xxxx pounds are to be left to any later great-grandchildren?
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  #787  
Old 05-17-2011, 08:58 PM
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Let's narrow the focus back to Beatrice and Eugenie, if you wish to discuss the future of the British monarchy under Charles, please do so here The Monarchy under Charles .

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  #788  
Old 06-06-2011, 09:38 AM
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Originally Posted by Iluvbertie View Post
I hope that both Beatrice and Eugenie gain careers away from the public sphere and have wonderful lives and are only seen at maybe the Trooping the Colour. I also wouldn't be surprised if Charles issues LPs to strip them of the HRH titles in time restricting those with it to the children of the monarch and the children of the heir.

The British public want a smaller royal family and they will get it with these girls going a different route so that in the Queen's grandchildren's generation there will only be the four royals - William, Kate, Harry and spouse.

I don't know about that; lately it appears as if Beatrice and Eugenie are turning up at more and more events with their father and the RF.

Or so it seems to me?
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  #789  
Old 06-06-2011, 07:45 PM
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They talk about reducing the size of the working royal family which is fine, but what about the 3500+ organizations which currently have a royal patron or president? Do anyone honestly believe that 4 working royals can provide the necessary support to these organizations and undertake official engagements throughout the UK and the Commonwealth?
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  #790  
Old 06-06-2011, 07:53 PM
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I don't know about that; lately it appears as if Beatrice and Eugenie are turning up at more and more events with their father and the RF.

Or so it seems to me?
I'm of the same opinion.
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  #791  
Old 06-07-2011, 01:29 PM
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I'm of the same opinion.
Perhaps we're seeing them more because it's that time of year when we have the really royal events (trooping of the colour, Derby, Ascot, Easter etc). The wedding was a bonus.
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  #792  
Old 06-19-2011, 03:57 AM
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I can't see why Beatrice and Eugenie can't get real jobs. Harry and William are both in the forces, Zara and Peter both work and I'm sure Edwards kids will be too one day. Beatrice just completed four years of uni surely she must want to do something. I see why Charles would want to cut things down especially with these two. Sarah I think is such a loose cannon and she seems to leech from her children and Andrew. Look at all the problems she has already caused. By not making the girls part of the family business protects the business from Sarah and her money making schemes. Beatrice is with a very rich guy and may not feel the need she has to work. Neither of Edwards children are Prince or Princess so it wouldn't be the end of the world if Andrew's children weren't fashioned as Princess. It actually seems to help. Part of this would be because of all the recent problems and Charles sounds like the less he has to worry about as king the better. I think Bagshot Park is way too big for Edward and his small family it is bigger then even Charles's place and clearly he can't afford it. It isn't up to Charles to pay for his brother's bills if they live so far out of their means. Andrew also supports Sarah, she lives in a royal house and lives a royal lifestyle all paid for by the public. I think the Queen will leave everyone something not just a chosen few no reason why Harry or William should be left out. It will be interesting to see what Beatrice and Eugenia do I think we will see another wedding in the next 12 months! The problem really for both these girls is like it or not they are tarnished by their mothers bad behaviour and their lack of dress sense really isn't helping things. If it isn't their hats it is their outfits and the more public they are the more bad attention they get. I'm not exactly sure what either of them could do but surely they can find something.
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Old 06-19-2011, 05:01 AM
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I can't see why Beatrice and Eugenie can't get real jobs. Harry and William are both in the forces, Zara and Peter both work and I'm sure Edwards kids will be too one day. Beatrice just completed four years of uni surely she must want to do something.
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Eugenie is at university for another year, it's hard to juggle uni and a job, I have to try next year. Beatrice may have finished Uni, but getting a job even as a Princess is hard in this climate. You can't compare them to their cousins seeing as they're older and at the same age as Beatrice and Eugenie, all four were partying until dawn. Also comparing them to Louise and James, that's ridiculously - we can't predict what those two are going to do in the next 15 years.
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  #794  
Old 07-01-2011, 08:25 PM
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Princess Beatrice receives 2:1 in her history degree - mirror.co.uk

Beatrice has achieved a 2.1 in her degree of history and history of ideas (William also got a 2.1 in his degree).

I wonder what she will do with it or next now.
It wouldn't surprise me if she were to take on more and more royal duties, even if she does have a job. Many members of the RF are quite elderly and will probably gradually ease back on their commitments, William and Harry have their military careers, so someone needs to pick up the slack.

I thought it was very nice of her to lavish such praise on her tutors and the college.
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Old 07-01-2011, 08:31 PM
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It wouldn't surprise me if she were to take on more and more royal duties, even if she does have a job. Many members of the RF are quite elderly and will probably gradually ease back on their commitments, William and Harry have their military careers, so someone needs to pick up the slack.

I thought it was very nice of her to lavish such praise on her tutors and the college.

We do, of course, have the reports from earlier this year that the girls have been told that they are to get jobs as they aren't going to be doing royal duties.

I do think if they have full time jobs then they can't be expected to also do royal duties.
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Old 07-01-2011, 09:03 PM
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It has been made pretty clear they are not wanted for Royal Duties. Has to do with their mother and the awkward situations she has caused. Charles wants the monarchy made smaller. They have to get real jobs. They will of course show up at the family events like Viscount Linley etc do. There is no reason why they shouldn't start working Peter and Zara both have careers, Princess Margarets children both worked. I wouldn't be surprised if Branson offered her some sort of job although what she is actually qualified to do is a good question. Yes she has a degree but what exactly can she do with it? I seem to remember some talk of her and fashion, which isn't a good idea especially after that hat! I do think she needs to do something on her own and not join up with her mother and her ventures.
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Old 07-01-2011, 09:29 PM
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It has been made pretty clear they are not wanted for Royal Duties. Has to do with their mother and the awkward situations she has caused. Charles wants the monarchy made smaller. They have to get real jobs. They will of course show up at the family events like Viscount Linley etc do. There is no reason why they shouldn't start working Peter and Zara both have careers, Princess Margarets children both worked. I wouldn't be surprised if Branson offered her some sort of job although what she is actually qualified to do is a good question. Yes she has a degree but what exactly can she do with it? I seem to remember some talk of her and fashion, which isn't a good idea especially after that hat! I do think she needs to do something on her own and not join up with her mother and her ventures.

It has nothing to do with her mother at all.

It has to do with the aims of reducing the size of the royal family and was made clear to them as a result of Andrew and the peadophile earlier this year.

With a history degree she is able to do anything that involves research. With a degree in history of ideas she is also able to do things that involve thinking things through and seeing relationships between ideas and implementation - true humanitarian type degrees.

As someone with a history degree I do find it strange that people don't understand what use the degree is - research, communication and general understanding of a range of issues and cultures immediately come to mind.

When she has done charity work - which is what royals do - it has been largely associated with one or more of her mothers charities e.g. Children in Crisis of which Sarah is patron.
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Old 07-01-2011, 09:33 PM
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But then who is to attend events, once the Kents, Gloucesters, Princess Alexandra do not?

As for her degree, perhaps she could work in a museum or library?

No one.

The idea, as I understand it, is that there will be fewer royal duties overall being undertaken as there will be fewer people to do the work and those that are doing the royal duties will be doing more.

Charles doesn't really even want his brothers doing too much - his sister yes but not even Andrew and Edward and certainly not their children. He does realise however that there are no other options for Andrew and Edward but he is certainly behind the reduction of the size of the royal family and this impacts on Beatrice and Eugenie first - with them being told to get real jobs (and also shows up with things like no HRH for Edward's children).

Harry's children will also not be called upon in the future.

Kate, William, Harry and Harry's spouse will have to do the work of the Kents, Gloucesters along with pick up those of the Duke of Edinburgh and The Queen (those that Charles can't pick up).

Simply put - fewer working royals = fewer royal duties and fewer organisations etc with a royal being involved.
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Old 07-01-2011, 09:47 PM
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I really can't see how both girls won't be used for royal duties if they choose to do so. They are their own people despite who their mother is and it is not fair they they be punished for that. Not implying that Charles is heartless a smaller monarchy really doesn't matter to him as his kids future is already set so in a sense of saying that's no skin off his nose on that point. It's his brother's & sister's children who have to find a role in their future. However the truth of the matter is the current royal family is getting older and royal duties for older members of the BRF will decline more & more as time passes. I read somewhere since Will & Kate's wedding that interest in the BRF has increased so I would the royal duties from added interest will increase. Consider how old Charles could be by the time he becomes King. So I don't see how it would be wise two exclude two people who have the HRH already if they are willing to do the work......Just my thoughts.
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Old 07-28-2011, 06:39 PM
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I read where Prince Andrew had asked the Queen for a request to have Beatrice be a working royal and the Queen turned him down. Does that mean that she will not be able to have a job or a job that pays. I'm assuming the term working royal means the person has some type of job and would get paid like anyone else doing a similiar job.

I think the Queen will protect the interests of Prince Andrew's daughters. They will not be left out in the cold.
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