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  #441  
Old 09-15-2006, 07:52 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by johann
And may I give you my impression? All I see is a talented women disappearing behind her husband. And this hurts.

You see that , well I don't.

What I see is a Princess who attends acts besides her husband and is welcomed in every act with great expectation and joy by the organization and the people that are present on those acts.


I don't believe white suits are so predictable in Letizia as you suggest, but I agree calls too much attention (suits her really well in my opinion... I even disagreed with Anna_R when she said Red was Letizia colour - I think it is white), but in a few weeks winter will be back and she will not have many chances to wear them.

Then, maybe we can return to the other predictable things, the cut of the hair, the weight and the solo acts... one goes, three more to go so we can just apreciate (or not) the way things are done by Spanish Royal House without falling in temptation to be always comparing royal houses, persons, acts etc. And I'm not being cynic, which is an art I still have to develop, I'm being honest. Because what hurts me is to see royals being compared all the time, and they're not even competing to know that they have to beat so many in so many fronts ...

I don't believe Letizia attending alone would have more impact, would have the same*, because she would be there doing the same thing that she does with her husband - honouring people, institutions and initiatives. Now this last part is totally predictable in me, because that's what I really feel.


(* not exactly the same - the day she start going out on solo no-one will pay attention to speach or her work, the problem will be the marital problems that are behind the Royal House decision to make her go alone because the Princes' relation is so bad that they not even go to acts together - difficult times to come)


Regards,
mtbcm
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  #442  
Old 09-16-2006, 03:52 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by magnik
Probably when she became a Queen Consort or when Sofia wouldn't can do smth Or just when "the right time" come.
I like your reply. One more here: one of those days when Felipe would rather have drinks with his buddies like a certain CP up north than going to a charity event with his wife, Letizia would have a solo event . I'm afraid Felipe is simply too dutiful :).
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  #443  
Old 09-16-2006, 11:23 AM
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I haven't been around in a couple of weeks—thanks for all the photos. I particularly liked the ones from the wedding they attended. Here are a couple more from Zuma Press in Barcelona.

http://www.zpicturegroup.com/search_...s+in+Barcelona

It's funny that the discussion never seems to change around here. I think some posters need to simple accept that Letizia will never be a clothing horse (if you want to follow a royal who is, there are plenty of other royals to watch) and, more substantially, that the Spanish Royal House has made a very clear decision that Felipe and Letizia will have the same agenda for the foreseeable future. They have clearly rejected the "princess as celebrity" style of other houses and have embraced instead a "team" (Felipe's own description of them) approach. If it bothers you or annoys you or bores you, don’t follow them—because it's not going to change. Among other reasons, because the "team" approach works for this royal house; there is absolutely no advantage gained by the crown by giving them separate agendas at this point in time. Together–-as a couple--they have an undeniable charisma. They are ingrained now in the public mind as a team, as a single unit with a common purpose. That, in conjunction with the dignity and elegance of their manner, and their warmth and "simpatia"—makes for a very powerful public image—a public image which favors first and foremost the Crown as an institution of State. The individuals are not elevated, but the unit and the common purpose—which is of course the interests of Spain.

I know many of you disagree, but that's how I see it. And for this particular Royal House in this particular country, it has proven to be a beneficial and successful approach.

As I said, if you don’t like to see them share an agenda—because it annoys you or offends you or bores you--don’t waste your time watching them because it's not going to change anytime soon. I know I certainly have stopped following other royals because they bored me or I grew to dislike them. I for one will continue to watch Felipe and Letizia and continue to be interested in them, in part, because they have chosen a course and a style so different from and so in contrast to the celebrity-bravado of so many of today's public figures.
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  #444  
Old 09-16-2006, 12:07 PM
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I completely agree with you and you did a great job in summarizing this great couple's role.
  #445  
Old 09-16-2006, 01:35 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lucys
It's funny that the discussion never seems to change around here. I think some posters need to simple accept that Letizia will never be a clothing horse (if you want to follow a royal who is, there are plenty of other royals to watch) and, more substantially, that the Spanish Royal House has made a very clear decision that Felipe and Letizia will have the same agenda for the foreseeable future. They have clearly rejected the "princess as celebrity" style of other houses and have embraced instead a "team" (Felipe's own description of them) approach. If it bothers you or annoys you or bores you, don’t follow them—because it's not going to change. Among other reasons, because the "team" approach works for this royal house; there is absolutely no advantage gained by the crown by giving them separate agendas at this point in time. Together–-as a couple--they have an undeniable charisma. They are ingrained now in the public mind as a team, as a single unit with a common purpose. That, in conjunction with the dignity and elegance of their manner, and their warmth and "simpatia"—makes for a very powerful public image—a public image which favors first and foremost the Crown as an institution of State. The individuals are not elevated, but the unit and the common purpose—which is of course the interests of Spain.

I know many of you disagree, but that's how I see it. And for this particular Royal House in this particular country, it has proven to be a beneficial and successful approach.

As I said, if you don’t like to see them share an agenda—because it annoys you or offends you or bores you--don’t waste your time watching them because it's not going to change anytime soon. I know I certainly have stopped following other royals because they bored me or I grew to dislike them. I for one will continue to watch Felipe and Letizia and continue to be interested in them, in part, because they have chosen a course and a style so different from and so in contrast to the celebrity-bravado of so many of today's public figures.
May the best analysis of the Princes's team, very clever and appropriate to the spanish situation. Congratulation for your sumarize in a very good words!!!

I share absolutly your description.
  #446  
Old 09-16-2006, 02:36 PM
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I have not just accepted it ... I believe that the excesses are not good ... and though it seems to me to be good and I understand the reasons for which the Royal House has decided that the agenda should be hereby ... it does not stop seeming to me that they have taken it towards an end. Letizia also needs a bit from independence, to demonstrate that she also can make the things without the Prince, give her the activity and the protagonism that as Princess of Asturias must have. Two years and a half have passed from the wedding, Leonor already has born ... already it is time of that her little air. On Tuesday, she will be the protagonist of the act, but there the Prince will be. A hearing or a charitable or cultural act once a month .. the Prince of Asturias comes now to all the acts with the Princess, but later he has his hearings and his military acts.
That Letizia occupies her colitigant's place it is good ... but she is the Princess of Asturias, the future Queen ... and this situation in the long term can be harmful ... she should have already a minimum of independence, she would win and the Royal Family would win.
  #447  
Old 09-16-2006, 03:00 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by donnaK
I like your reply. One more here: one of those days when Felipe would rather have drinks with his buddies like a certain CP up north than going to a charity event with his wife, Letizia would have a solo event . I'm afraid Felipe is simply too dutiful :).
I dislike your reply. Is Letizia having drinks and socializing with her girlfriends when she is not attending one of her husband's solo engagements? Surely Felipe can let Letizia attend an event on her own for which she is patron and keep himself busy either with his daughter or with behind the scenes preparation of one of his solo engagements.
Quote:
Originally Posted by lucys
It's funny that the discussion never seems to change around here. I think some posters need to simple accept that Letizia will never be a clothing horse (if you want to follow a royal who is, there are plenty of other royals to watch) and, more substantially, that the Spanish Royal House has made a very clear decision that Felipe and Letizia will have the same agenda for the foreseeable future. They have clearly rejected the "princess as celebrity" style of other houses and have embraced instead a "team" (Felipe's own description of them) approach.
I am staunchly annoyed by the reasoning that if other royal couples aren't doing things the way that Felipe and Letizia are that they are in some ways inferior. Calling the princesses of other royal houses "clothes horses" or "celebrities" is in my opinion a gross devaluation of the serious work that many royal princesses do.
  #448  
Old 09-16-2006, 03:22 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lula
I have not just accepted it ... I believe that the excesses are not good ... and though it seems to me to be good and I understand the reasons for which the Royal House has decided that the agenda should be hereby ... it does not stop seeming to me that they have taken it towards an end. Letizia also needs a bit from independence, to demonstrate that she also can make the things without the Prince, give her the activity and the protagonism that as Princess of Asturias must have. Two years and a half have passed from the wedding, Leonor already has born ... already it is time of that her little air. On Tuesday, she will be the protagonist of the act, but there the Prince will be. A hearing or a charitable or cultural act once a month .. the Prince of Asturias comes now to all the acts with the Princess, but later he has his hearings and his military acts.
That Letizia occupies her colitigant's place it is good ... but she is the Princess of Asturias, the future Queen ... and this situation in the long term can be harmful ... she should have already a minimum of independence, she would win and the Royal Family would win.
I absolutely agree with you Lula. And since you are the real expert in all Spanish matters, I appreciate your point of view even more, since I always watched Letizia from the distance. I guess less team work and more independence would do wonders on Letizia! It´s time for a change.

Quote:
Originally Posted by lucys
It's funny that the discussion never seems to change around here. I think some posters need to simple accept that Letizia will never be a clothing horse (if you want to follow a royal who is, there are plenty of other royals to watch) and, more substantially, that the Spanish Royal House has made a very clear decision that Felipe and Letizia will have the same agenda for the foreseeable future. They have clearly rejected the "princess as celebrity" style of other houses and have embraced instead a "team" (Felipe's own description of them) approach. If it bothers you or annoys you or bores you, don’t follow them—because it's not going to change. Among other reasons, because the "team" approach works for this royal house; there is absolutely no advantage gained by the crown by giving them separate agendas at this point in time. Together–-as a couple--they have an undeniable charisma. They are ingrained now in the public mind as a team, as a single unit with a common purpose. That, in conjunction with the dignity and elegance of their manner, and their warmth and "simpatia"—makes for a very powerful public image—a public image which favors first and foremost the Crown as an institution of State. The individuals are not elevated, but the unit and the common purpose—which is of course the interests of Spain.

I know many of you disagree, but that's how I see it. And for this particular Royal House in this particular country, it has proven to be a beneficial and successful approach.

As I said, if you don’t like to see them share an agenda—because it annoys you or offends you or bores you--don’t waste your time watching them because it's not going to change anytime soon. I know I certainly have stopped following other royals because they bored me or I grew to dislike them. I for one will continue to watch Felipe and Letizia and continue to be interested in them, in part, because they have chosen a course and a style so different from and so in contrast to the celebrity-bravado of so many of today's public figures.
@Lucys:
For once and all - you don’t have to tell me or any other poster, what to do with my/their time. We are all grown up enough to decide it ourselves. So please stop giving this kind of advises. But may I give you a hint? If you want a discussion according to your taste try the ignore list in your user control panel.

As for the clothing horse comment, come on this is – if you will pardon me saying so – imprudent. And I am really interested in all the names of all this royal “clothing horses” out there. I guess it will be difficult to defend your very special point of view.

For the rest I absolutely agree with Larzen’s eloquent post.
  #449  
Old 09-16-2006, 03:30 PM
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Im delighted with your post lula especially since you are spanish and I agree with it completely. The team is good, but the odd event alone is necessary to establish her as an independent Princess and future Queen also.
Quote:
Originally Posted by mtbcm
Then, maybe we can return to the other predictable things, the cut of the hair, the weight and the solo acts... one goes, three more to go so we can just apreciate (or not) the way things are done by Spanish Royal House without falling in temptation to be always comparing royal houses, persons, acts etc. And I'm not being cynic, which is an art I still have to develop, I'm being honest. Because what hurts me is to see royals being compared all the time, and they're not even competing to know that they have to beat so many in so many fronts ...
Quote:
Originally Posted by lucys
It's funny that the discussion never seems to change around here. I think some posters need to simple accept that Letizia will never be a clothing horse (if you want to follow a royal who is, there are plenty of other royals to watch) and, more substantially, that the Spanish Royal House has made a very clear decision that Felipe and Letizia will have the same agenda for the foreseeable future. They have clearly rejected the "princess as celebrity" style of other houses and have embraced instead a "team" (Felipe's own description of them) approach.
How is the discusion going to change when there is no (and I mean zero) development at the spanish court, what should we discuss about this Princess?
Not the clothes (because she is not a clotheshorse)
Not the hair (because it is so predicatable)
Not the weight (unless she is pregnant)
Not her soloacts (because she does not have any)
Not her speeches because she does not give any (Ok 1, and 1 comming up)
No comparrisons to other royals (unless it is to trash them to make F&L look good which seems to be allowed reading the posts in this very thread)

Adding to that that most of the people on this board dont read spanish, it makes it very difficult to start any deeper discussion on the acts they do where all we have is pictures and the odd video clip, usually of them walking, posing or sitting at a table or unveiling a plaque. What they look to be talking about, how interested the appeared in the plaque they were unveiling? So, exactly what new discussions are appropriate for this couple?

Yes I know it was a crass post but really it seems the only way to deffend this decision of Letizia agenda is to label the rest of the royals attention seeking hollywood clothehorse Princesses, just like it happened in the Luxembourg silverwedding event.
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  #450  
Old 09-16-2006, 04:10 PM
lula's Avatar
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Here there are many different ideas, which it is not necessary to mix.

I believe that the Royal Spanish House has a clear aim ... that the work of the Princes is seen as a serious work, that what is valued is it and not all the superfluous things that exist around. It has been like that always. Because of it, they have wanted to flee of the pressure and of the speculation that the press realized around Letizia. She is a colitigant and must be on the second plane. The Princes are figures of state, political ... they are not actors or singers ... they must be protagonists of the newspapers and not of the frivolous "pink" press. Letizia's appearances, initially, the press would have turned them into a "circus".And possibly certain press had given a frivolous image of which they want to flee.

The idea was good and it continue being. Personally, it does not seem to me to be normal what has happened and I read that it happens in other countries. The Monarchies are institutions, which follow a line, where the position is inherited ... for the monarchies it is not good that the princesses colitigants turn into very popular prominent figures who end up by darkening their husbands. Evidently a woman in a charitable act with a nice suit, always turns out to be more enterteining and popular than a man with a gray suit surrounded with businessmen. I understand it, but it does not seem to me to be positive for the Monarchies that the citizens of a country think that a colitigant can do better work that a prince inheritor ... because it is a danger.

It was initially well, but I continue thinking that if it was a good idea initially, I do not believe that it is anything that could be kept for a long time. I believe that it is it, a question of time. The Princes strain for doing a serious work, but unfortunately often this serious work, it is transmitted by certain press of a frivolous way, and it gives an incorrect image to the people. The Princes like team give a major sensation of unit and of serious work ... possibly if the Princess was coming to these acts alone, it would be easier for certain press it to transmit in a frivolous way to the public.

They must transmit a serious and responsible image, of work to the service of the country ... but often it is very difficult, for questions totally foreign to they.
  #451  
Old 09-16-2006, 04:20 PM
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Please, remember it's Current Events thread.

I don't think we need to get personal. Everyone has the right of opinion, please respect it.
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  #452  
Old 09-16-2006, 06:17 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Alisa
I dislike your reply. Is Letizia having drinks and socializing with her girlfriends when she is not attending one of her husband's solo engagements? Surely Felipe can let Letizia attend an event on her own for which she is patron and keep himself busy either with his daughter or with behind the scenes preparation of one of his solo engagements.
I was half joking. Nevertheless, your answer is fine with me. You can have Felipe's 'can-do' list when his wife goes to an event, so can I .
So far Letizia only skipped the short meetings at Zarzuela, military exercises (she is irrelevant here) and a few presidential inaugurations in Latin America. I'd like to see her going for drinks with her girlfriends when her hubby is away on duty .
  #453  
Old 09-16-2006, 08:01 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lucys
I haven't been around in a couple of weeks—thanks for all the photos. I particularly liked the ones from the wedding they attended. Here are a couple more from Zuma Press in Barcelona.

http://www.zpicturegroup.com/search_...s+in+Barcelona

It's funny that the discussion never seems to change around here. I think some posters need to simple accept that Letizia will never be a clothing horse (if you want to follow a royal who is, there are plenty of other royals to watch) and, more substantially, that the Spanish Royal House has made a very clear decision that Felipe and Letizia will have the same agenda for the foreseeable future. They have clearly rejected the "princess as celebrity" style of other houses and have embraced instead a "team" (Felipe's own description of them) approach. If it bothers you or annoys you or bores you, don’t follow them—because it's not going to change. Among other reasons, because the "team" approach works for this royal house; there is absolutely no advantage gained by the crown by giving them separate agendas at this point in time. Together–-as a couple--they have an undeniable charisma. They are ingrained now in the public mind as a team, as a single unit with a common purpose. That, in conjunction with the dignity and elegance of their manner, and their warmth and "simpatia"—makes for a very powerful public image—a public image which favors first and foremost the Crown as an institution of State. The individuals are not elevated, but the unit and the common purpose—which is of course the interests of Spain.

I know many of you disagree, but that's how I see it. And for this particular Royal House in this particular country, it has proven to be a beneficial and successful approach.

As I said, if you don’t like to see them share an agenda—because it annoys you or offends you or bores you--don’t waste your time watching them because it's not going to change anytime soon. I know I certainly have stopped following other royals because they bored me or I grew to dislike them. I for one will continue to watch Felipe and Letizia and continue to be interested in them, in part, because they have chosen a course and a style so different from and so in contrast to the celebrity-bravado of so many of today's public figures.
You expressed my exact thoughts - I like the fact that Felipe and Letizia are a team.
  #454  
Old 09-16-2006, 11:09 PM
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IMO the "team thing" is a justification to the fact that Letizia doesn't have solo acts. Infanta Cristina has solo acts as well as Infanta Elena, Don Juan Carlos and Da. Sofia has and have always had solo acts, the Royal House was/is not affraid or against to solo acts (in fact they can do more when they split out and divide forces) but when it comes only on Letizia and Felipe's case here they come again the justifications.

IMO they should do some things as a couple and other in solitary, is Letizia less than the rest of the princess? Intellectually I don't thing so and therefore I would like to see her doing something by herself, hear her voice, taking patronages or working as Maxima with the microcredits, Mette Marit with the AIDS or Mary with the Science and Medicine causes.
  #455  
Old 09-17-2006, 07:33 AM
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Jaime de Marichalar and Iñaki Urdangarin dont have solo acts. The same happens with Letizia. These three people are known because they are husbands/wife of members of the Royal Family, nothing more.
  #456  
Old 09-17-2006, 07:39 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fanletizia
Jaime de Marichalar and Iñaki Urdangarin dont have solo acts. The same happens with Letizia. These three people are known because they are husbands/wife of members of the Royal Family, nothing more.
It is true, but also it is true that Letizia is Princess of Asturias, and occupies a status recognized in a Royal Decree, place that neither Jaime nor Iñaki occupy. Therefore the cincunstancias are not the same. Letizia must look like the Queen, not Jaime and Iñaki...Because of it before so later the circumstances must change, because as soon as the first years pass sense will not make.
  #457  
Old 09-17-2006, 09:49 AM
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We can accepted with any doubt the competence and the role of Maxima in the Micro credit field, it's a metter of bank work in which the Princess of Orange had high responsabilties before her wedding.
We can recognized the deep engagement of Mett Marit in the fight against AIDS, mondial scourge.
But what are exactly activities so important of thePrincess of Denmark for Science and Medical cause (s )?

Micro Credit and AIDS are two fields very important in the World problems of today, and for two Crown Princess to lead some activities for that is an altruitistic attitude in foreign affairs, but not for their respective countries.

In my opinion, but it's not necessary the good one, the Spanish Crown Princes have to work fisrt of ALL to know all the difficulties inside their frontiers ( except the Felipe's preserve of his role in America Latina and for the Cervantes institut )

For that the concept of the team working to know their country and to be known as the futur souvereigns is totaly relevant because contrary at the others Crown Princes they have to work together for the conquest of their throne.

Letizia will to have a lot of time to have alone a charity activity or a cultural one and I'm sure that it's planed
  #458  
Old 09-17-2006, 10:39 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fanletizia
Jaime de Marichalar and Iñaki Urdangarin dont have solo acts. The same happens with Letizia. These three people are known because they are husbands/wife of members of the Royal Family, nothing more.
About Jaime, i don't know but Iñaki already had some solo acts.
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  #459  
Old 09-17-2006, 11:17 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ...JuAnItA...
About Jaime, i don't know but Iñaki already had some solo acts.
Do not get confused. Neither Jaime nor Iñaki have official acts. They have acts of the companies or of the organizations at which they are employed, but they come as private persons not as members of the Royal Family. Neither Jaime nor Iñaki have official independent activity.
  #460  
Old 09-17-2006, 01:27 PM
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But surely because Letizia is Spain's future Queen (consort I know but still), she needs to have her own agenda?? I think it's a real shame that she doesn't. Sorry if this has been asked before, but how long after Juan Carlos became King did Sofia have her own acts?
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