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  #181  
Old 07-27-2007, 10:54 PM
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Originally Posted by Duke of Marmalade View Post
Well, keeping in mind the situation of the spanish monarchy, being in constant danger of being abolished, we don't know what kind of Crown Prince Felipe would be if he was in WA's or Fred's position. He has no choice but to work and please the public, that's not his decision. He has to earn his position every day, according to Daddy's motto, but I am pretty sure there are days he'd go sailing if only he could instead of inaugurating the twentysixth exhibiton that month.

Felipe is not a more worthy CP than others. He simply acts according to the circumstances of his country, as WA, Fred and all the others do. Bad luck for him that sailing means vacation and is not part of the working schedule
The complaint is that Felipe does not work, not whether he works out of necessity or love for his work. Saying Felipe doesn't work is simply untrue. He works a lot, much more than his counterparts in other countries. His motivation isn't the point of discussion.
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  #182  
Old 07-27-2007, 11:11 PM
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Originally Posted by Roxsteve View Post
This is a no-win situation. There are those who are going to defend the CP till death and there are others who are not (like me). I don't think it is bad to give an opinion one way or another. You are not going to change my mind. I just have a different opinion. It's not bad or good, it is just that an opinion. I don't want to argue with anyone, but just as you have a right to say what you like about them, I also have a right to express my opinion. I think they have an easy life and I don't think of Felipe's "agenda" as work. I just don't. Sorry!
When you say ALL Felipe does is going to weddings, funerals, baptisms, it was simply factually untrue. That's not a matter of opinion. You are entitled to your opinion whether his work of traveling aboard representing Spain, meeting with domestic business organizations, consoling the family of terrorism victims etc. is easy or not. But Felipe does much much more than attending weddings, funerals and baptisms. That is a fact.
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  #183  
Old 07-27-2007, 11:26 PM
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Originally Posted by Duke of Marmalade View Post
While Felipe is mostly judged on his work - and even ridiculed or critizised despite a heavy workload, see El Jueves - why shouldn't others be able to schedule their workloads or life as CPs differently if they are not scrutinized that much in their countries because the monarchy has a different standing there? Different countries, different points of view and at the end of the day it's down to the respective public to decide if what they do is valuable enough for survival or not. So if the Danes love Fred for sailing and think it is a valuable asset for Denmark no need for him to work his butt of.
In these days and age, anyone gets paid by the taxpayers and takes the taxpayers' goodwill for granted will live to regret it one day.
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  #184  
Old 07-27-2007, 11:59 PM
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Originally Posted by Henri M. View Post
The same policy as in Spain (insulting the King or his House) also applies in the Netherlands. Two years ago a father and his son even were arrested in the heat of the night because they have deeply insulted the Prince of Orange and Princess Mxima on a forum like this.... (Not that the action was initiated by the princely couple. It was the Mayor of The Hague who ordered the police to take action). The two did spend two nights in jail and were fined for a few hundreds of Euros and ordered to be banned by the internet provider. Just for insulting royals on a forum like this.

And now this action by the Amsterdam police to a foreigner who yelled insulting remarks about the Queen. It is even so that not only the Queen but also intentedly insulting a 'befriended head of state' is prosecutable (also for this there are example of prosecution and fines , like for insulting the Emperor of Japan or the President of the United States). Famous were the many actions in the 1960's who yelled 'Johnson Murderer!' in the streets of Dutch cities (during the Vietnam War). The authorities were not amused to use an understatement. A man (protesting against the Zorreguieta connection with the Junta) who threw a little plastic bag with flour to a carriage in which the Prince of Orange and Princess Mxima were seated, also was thrown into jail and fined for 250 Euro and 40 hours or something community service.

I only wanted to make clear that Spain is not unique in this. Or undemocratic. Or backward. Many more countries, no matter monarchy or republic, have the same sort of laws concerning the protection of the head of state.


They should put people in jail then when they insult President Bush. It happens in every country--they dislike Bush so much that they should also be in jail then. Isn't it the same? This is 2007!!! Thank God we are not being decapitated for saying things about the royals. Bush gets insulted, even in this forum, and has been called so many things. We may not have a queen or king, but we have a president and others should respect him as well, right? I agree that the magazine was insulting to the couple, but to put people in jail for that, I don't know about that.
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  #185  
Old 07-28-2007, 05:03 AM
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For whom has not found out...

The District attorney already has modified the crime, now more to what they can condemn them it is to a fine.
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  #186  
Old 07-28-2007, 07:11 AM
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Insulting Bush is also prosecutable (in the Netherlands)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Roxsteve View Post
They should put people in jail then when they insult President Bush. It happens in every country--they dislike Bush so much that they should also be in jail then. Isn't it the same? This is 2007!!! Thank God we are not being decapitated for saying things about the royals. Bush gets insulted, even in this forum, and has been called so many things. We may not have a queen or king, but we have a president and others should respect him as well, right? I agree that the magazine was insulting to the couple, but to put people in jail for that, I don't know about that.
This is still possible. Make a difference between protesting against the policy of the president of the United States or qualifying him in a personal and insulting manner. That last one files under "insulting a befriended head of state" and can result in prosecution indeed.

In 2002 a Belgian activiste was arrested in the Netherlands because she compared President Bush with Hitler. On order of the Amsterdam Public Prosecutor she was arrested because of "intentionally unsulting the head of a befriended nation, namely the President of the United States of America, mr. George Walker Bush, by distributing pamphlets in the East Park in Amsterdam with the text "Bush & Hitler: No difference".

In the Netherlands Penal Code you can find three articles on crimen laesae maiestatis:

Article 111:
Intentional insulting of The King is prosecutable with a detention of maximum 5 years and/or a monetary fine of the fourth category.

Article 112:
Intentional insulting of the spouse of The King, the Heir Apparent and the spouse of the Heir Apparent is prosecutable with a detention of maximum 4 years and/or a monetary fine of the fourth category.

Article 113:
He who openly distributes written or imagined contents in which an insult is made of The King, the spouse of The King, the Heir Apparent, the spouse of the Heir Apparent or the Regent, or has these in stock and is aware of the insulting content of it, is prosecutable with a detention of maximum 1 year and/or a monetary fine of the third category.
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  #187  
Old 08-07-2007, 10:54 AM
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Yak !

I just have seen the caricature on the net and find it pornografic material. Should it be about the Royal family or not. To my opinion, this is not supposed to appear in a public magazine or newspaper anyway.

I also can imagine the embarasment of TRM Doa Letizia and Don Felipe. WOULD THE AUTHOR LIKE TO BE DESCRIBED IN SUCH A POSITION HIMSELF ???

El Jueves definitely is classed now in my mind into gossips coarse papers. Disgusting and not funny at all.
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  #188  
Old 08-09-2007, 04:12 PM
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I'm going on after to have spend some weeks at ...Palma! Yes, the web is a very useful instrument to speak when ( sometime ) you have nothing to tell. But may be, it will be better to hear Lula who tell the spirit of the facts ( I can say is exactly the reality ) than repeat and repeat some events or considerations which are very far away of the reality.

When we analyse the facts we have to do whith a open mind and not always with a " parti pris " always totaly far away of the reality!!!! I'm totally astonished when I read some considerations about the work of the Princes...We have to read the agenda of the Royal House, the single authority who decide of their work!
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  #189  
Old 08-23-2007, 07:42 AM
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El Rey vende un desnudo de Letizia en la nueva portada de 'El Jueves' - 20minutos.es

The King sells a naked one of Letizia in the new cover of 'El Jueves'
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  #190  
Old 08-23-2007, 08:55 AM
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Originally Posted by fanprincipesasturi View Post
El Rey vende un desnudo de Letizia en la nueva portada de 'El Jueves' - 20minutos.es

The King sells a naked one of Letizia in the new cover of 'El Jueves'
It's only and very stupidly eye-catching! Once in the grotesque conditions of the caption of the month of july, we can discuss about the " purity" of the El Jueves 's aims, why not? But now, it's money!
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  #191  
Old 08-23-2007, 09:17 AM
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They obtained more sales with the magazine of the flower and the special one on the "kidnapping", but later they did a normal number and lost readers .... now they want to return to sell more magazines.
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  #192  
Old 08-30-2007, 09:02 AM
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Interstitial - Noticia

The District attorney's office of the National Hearing has asked for a fine of 3.600 Euros for both authors of the cartoon of the Princes of Asturias in the front page of the magazine 'El Jueves', which motivated kidnapping last July 20 for a supposed crime of damages to the successor of the Wreath.
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  #193  
Old 08-30-2007, 11:04 AM
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Originally Posted by lula View Post
They obtained more sales with the magazine of the flower and the special one on the "kidnapping", but later they did a normal number and lost readers .... now they want to return to sell more magazines.
Well, they've changed their slogan after the 'kidnapping' in July...so now, every magazine says "El Jueves, the magazine that gets kidnapped on Fridays"... catchy!

"La revista que secuestran el viernes": nuevo lema de 'El Jueves' - 20minutos.es
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  #194  
Old 08-31-2007, 04:25 AM
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more information on the verdict
http://www.france24.com/france24Publ...o1huz&cat=null
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  #195  
Old 09-03-2007, 08:18 AM
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another article about the verdict. the director of El Jueves says the'd do another cover again any time - the whole issue was very successful for them, at cost of the princes.

what might happen next time? will the public be annoyed by the jokes or will the judges be more careful with issuing a ban?

Spanish humourists to go on trial for royal sex caricature : Europe World
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  #196  
Old 11-12-2007, 11:47 AM
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ElPais.com reports that El Jueves magazine has sent today a press release to the media, announcing that tomorrow, the two cartoonists are going to court in Madrid. The press release has a funny pin attached to it. Quite hilarious!

'El Jueves' da 'la chapa' ante el juicio por injurias a la Corona. ELPAS.com
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  #197  
Old 11-12-2007, 11:53 AM
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The press release says:

" 'Justice does not wait!'

Paradoxes of destiny, tomorrow tuesday and 13th will the trial to the authors of the infamous cover n 1575 take place. Well dressed, well-combed and with the shoestrings well tied-up (as mothers and lawyers reccomended) (...) May the force be with them!' "
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  #198  
Old 11-13-2007, 09:01 AM
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El juez declara culpables de injurias al Heredero a los autores de la vieta | elmundo.es

The judge declares the Inheritor culprits of damages to the authors of the caricture

The justice that has judged today Guillermo Torres y Manel Fontdevila has failed after listening to their declaration that both are culprits of a crime of damages to the Prince Inheritor. The judge Jose Maria Vzquez Honrubia thinks that the emblem of the Princes of Asturias published in the front page of ' El Jueves ' was unnecessary to realize a critique to the check - baby of the Government, which according to yhe authors, was the aim of the cartoon.

The failure applies the article 401.1 of the Penal Code and condemns both defendants to the payment of a fine of 3.000 Euros, the half of what the district attorney had requested.
...
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  #199  
Old 11-13-2007, 11:58 AM
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BBC NEWS | Europe | Viewpoint: Media freedom dented

pity about the judgement
have not seen the cartoon but from what I read in this bbc article it sounds funny
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  #200  
Old 11-13-2007, 12:08 PM
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Originally Posted by susan alicia View Post
BBC NEWS | Europe | Viewpoint: Media freedom dented

pity about the judgement
have not seen the cartoon but from what I read in this bbc article it sounds funny
The article called the fine "hefty" - 3.600 EURO is not much money in that sense IMO. For the magazine it's better to be convicted than to walk free in terms of ammunition for future issues of El Jueves as the limitation of freedom of speech has just been confirmed by a judge
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