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  #421  
Old 02-09-2007, 10:08 AM
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Since this tragic event for the Princess of Asturias and all her relatives, I' m reading all the articles that I can found, watching at all the videos that I can have access and stay principally on a spanish forum one which I found some very intersting discussions or so deep condolences, proofs of so great sadness for the Princess and her relatives, some so emotive rings of truth to share the regrets of the Princess of Asturias and all her relatives, that I didn't take the time to discuss on the question of WHY, WHATand WHEN!

It's true that for me the more important consideration it's the pain of all the members of the familie(s) of Letizia.

I don't recognize myself the right to judge so and so, this tragic event is unfortunatly a private decision taken by someone for whom we don't have all the keys of her mental landscape.

The process who can leeds at a depress state is a so peculiar "affaire" that I don't think that nobody have the right to make lesson on how we have to thaught, to accept this opinion or another as "the truth".

I didn't reed yet all the posts regarding this so tragic event - I say tragic because for any family to loose a child/ grand daughter/sister/sister in law and first of all MOTHER is a so serious that only the respect of the pain is an acceptable attitud.

I hope that reading this thread, I shalln't read so brillant theories about item as " the suicide" as a thruth to scream on the roofs....
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  #422  
Old 02-09-2007, 10:11 AM
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MADRID: Erika Ortiz Rocasolano funeral service - pictures of the family arriving & the infantas - pictures
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  #423  
Old 02-09-2007, 10:16 AM
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I want to add that even against myself, may be I can accepted an idea given by the "FAMA" before to know by official means what is happened exactly.

But it's not at all my preoccupations, my main thaught are the regrets, the courage, and the union of two families to survive after such an event. The else, I have to admit that is only egoïstic litterature.... It's so difficile
  #424  
Old 02-09-2007, 10:32 AM
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I really can not believe that it has been suggested that Erika killed herself because of Letizia being who she was!

I hope Letizia herself hasn't heard about this theory because at a time like this when she is feeling so sensitive, something like this could really cause harm to her
  #425  
Old 02-09-2007, 10:36 AM
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Some people have the ability and desire to take devastating circumstances and create something positive out of it. Q. Silvia did so with her mother's suffering from dementia and brought the issue out in the open to great benefit for dementia patients and their families and the medical field. I believe we may see Letizia and Felipe embrace the issues around the speculated depression and suicide of Erika. Too many families are dealing with the pain of a family member's suffering yet it is still not something many of us know how to help out with or spot the symptoms. I don't think this death will be in vain - Felipe and Letizia will use it for some good for other families.
  #426  
Old 02-09-2007, 10:42 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by grevinnan
Some people have the ability and desire to take devastating circumstances and create something positive out of it. Q. Silvia did so with her mother's suffering from dementia and brought the issue out in the open to great benefit for dementia patients and their families and the medical field. I believe we may see Letizia and Felipe embrace the issues around the speculated depression and suicide of Erika. Too many families are dealing with the pain of a family member's suffering yet it is still not something many of us know how to help out with or spot the symptoms. I don't think this death will be in vain - Felipe and Letizia will use it for some good for other families.

Whithout to be so affirmative in the words about this so tragic event, I like your way of thaught, very positive!
  #427  
Old 02-09-2007, 11:00 AM
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Unhappy

I've been in the middle of a deep freeze here with bad pipes, etc, so only now am hearing this sad sad news. My heart goes out to Letizia especially as she's carrying a baby and this has got to be devastating for her and the Ortiz family. My prayers and thoughts are with them today.
  #428  
Old 02-09-2007, 11:23 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by grevinnan
Some people have the ability and desire to take devastating circumstances and create something positive out of it. Q. Silvia did so with her mother's suffering from dementia and brought the issue out in the open to great benefit for dementia patients and their families and the medical field. I believe we may see Letizia and Felipe embrace the issues around the speculated depression and suicide of Erika. Too many families are dealing with the pain of a family member's suffering yet it is still not something many of us know how to help out with or spot the symptoms. I don't think this death will be in vain - Felipe and Letizia will use it for some good for other families.
I agree with you!Maybe they can put in their agenda some events regarding people suffering form depression and dementia, that may help them!
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  #429  
Old 02-09-2007, 11:51 AM
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At the end of the year 2003, when the Prince announce his enagemet with Leticia Ortiz, many people didn´t believed that Letizia had the necessary preparation to be a good Princess of Asturias and future Queen of Spain.
I wrote the following thing at those days:

"Letizia has the necessary conditions to be a great Princess of Asturias, the indispensable thing in the Future wife of the Prince is that her temperament, her quality humanizes,her tenacity and endurance, her aptitude to deal and to communicate with the most unlike people, are the best in a Future Queen."

I think that yesterday The Princess of Asturias demonstrated to all of us, her human quality.
For that, we must be to at her side in these moments of pain, because, i´m sure she will be ,undoubtedly, supporting to the Spanish people in their worse moments.

Today it is not the time to ask or discuss about what could happen to Érika Ortiz. Just its time to send a big embrace, full of hope and forces for Princess Letizia
  #430  
Old 02-09-2007, 11:56 AM
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I fell sorry for all the family
  #431  
Old 02-09-2007, 12:08 PM
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CNN anchor

I guess Iam a little behind the times but somebody said that the CNN correspondent that televised the death was a peculiar choice as he had a relationship with the Princess. What is his name? I grieve for the whole family but I do hope that the Princess doesnt get blamed for it. She is still alive and has to go on.
  #432  
Old 02-09-2007, 12:34 PM
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I fell sorry for all the family.
  #433  
Old 02-09-2007, 12:34 PM
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The director of theater Víctor Ullate dedicates his spectacle ' Samsará to Erika Ortiz
The director of theater Víctor Ullate today dedicated his spectacle ' Samsará, that will be able to be seen next the Saturday and Sunday in Sant Cugat (Barcelona), to the memory of Erika Ortiz, the smaller sister of Princess de passed away Asturias last Wednesday. Ullate began the press conference giving the condolence to the princess by the death of its sister and explained that the last time that she spoke with Letizia Ortiz of dance said to him ' when is told it my sister is going to give much to him envies knowledge that there am conocidó to you. ' it praised to Me very many that said that to me and I want to him to offer ' Samsará, that it is the cycle of the life and the death, all we are born and we died, meanwhile we happened through sufrimientó, indicated the director theater.
El director de teatro Víctor Ullate dedica su espectáculo 'Samsara' a Erika Ortiz
  #434  
Old 02-09-2007, 12:35 PM
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please agm they are video de cuatro for today?
  #435  
Old 02-09-2007, 12:44 PM
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This is all so very sad.... my condolences to the family.

I must say, I'm not sure I like the press being there.
  #436  
Old 02-09-2007, 12:45 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ...sOfIa....
I really can not believe that it has been suggested that Erika killed herself because of Letizia being who she was!

I hope Letizia herself hasn't heard about this theory because at a time like this when she is feeling so sensitive, something like this could really cause harm to her
How ridiculous blaming Letizia sounds! I always got the impression Erika didn't mind the publicity; I have definitely seen more of her than of Telma - or most members of Letizia's family. She could have been totally private very easily, and still wasn't exactly a tabloid darling.

If Erika didn't die of natural causes, her family will blame themselves just about no matter what. But they will be told what I have learnt, having someone close to me suffer from severe depression. It is a very complicated illness, and not at all easy to understand or recognise; many things can cause it, including such external things as medication for something else (a close friend hit the bottom just few weeks after starting infertility treatment; the meds given to her blocked serotonin production in her brain), physical illness, injuries, lack of sleep. It can progress very quickly and go unnoticed until something happens. Medication can make it much worse, or "cure" it almost instantly. And it is nobody's fault.

I pray them all strenght to pull through this dark time.
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  #437  
Old 02-09-2007, 01:40 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Paty
At the end of the year 2003, when the Prince announce his enagemet with Leticia Ortiz, many people didn´t believed that Letizia had the necessary preparation to be a good Princess of Asturias and future Queen of Spain.
I wrote the following thing at those days:

"Letizia has the necessary conditions to be a great Princess of Asturias, the indispensable thing in the Future wife of the Prince is that her temperament, her quality humanizes,her tenacity and endurance, her aptitude to deal and to communicate with the most unlike people, are the best in a Future Queen."

I think that yesterday The Princess of Asturias demonstrated to all of us, her human quality.
For that, we must be to at her side in these moments of pain, because, i´m sure she will be ,undoubtedly, supporting to the Spanish people in their worse moments.

Today it is not the time to ask or discuss about what could happen to Érika Ortiz. Just its time to send a big embrace, full of hope and forces for Princess Letizia

Yes, it's my feeling too, because who are us to decide if that is well or not well. But at the opposite to give help to somebody who needs your affectionate support, it's not necessary to make theory about the incidence of your behaviour in the life and the receptivity of your relatives about that you do or you are.

I want to express my more deep condolences to the Princess of Asturias and her relatives. And want to add something very frivolous - I apologize- in this so sad circonstances, even in the more deep pain the Princess of Asturias is totally stuning, her beauty yesterday was these of the sadness but which a so great beauty!
  #438  
Old 02-09-2007, 01:46 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by adelaide
Since this tragic event for the Princess of Asturias and all her relatives, I' m reading all the articles that I can found, watching at all the videos that I can have access and stay principally on a spanish forum one which I found some very intersting discussions or so deep condolences, proofs of so great sadness for the Princess and her relatives, some so emotive rings of truth to share the regrets of the Princess of Asturias and all her relatives, that I didn't take the time to discuss on the question of WHY, WHATand WHEN!

It's true that for me the more important consideration it's the pain of all the members of the familie(s) of Letizia.

I don't recognize myself the right to judge so and so, this tragic event is unfortunatly a private decision taken by someone for whom we don't have all the keys of her mental landscape.

The process who can leeds at a depress state is a so peculiar "affaire" that I don't think that nobody have the right to make lesson on how we have to thaught, to accept this opinion or another as "the truth".

I didn't reed yet all the posts regarding this so tragic event - I say tragic because for any family to loose a child/ grand daughter/sister/sister in law and first of all MOTHER is a so serious that only the respect of the pain is an acceptable attitud.

I hope that reading this thread, I shalln't read so brillant theories about item as " the suicide" as a thruth to scream on the roofs....

I agree with this, Adelaide and think it is a wise statement. Treat others the way you want to be treated is what comes to mind. We can speculate until we are blue in the face but the fact is we aren't intimates, we know none of the details, none of the path this alleged depression has taken and the toll it has taken on Erika and all her family and friends and over what period of time. All we know is she died and the family is apparently in profound distress and they deserve space and respect. Someone referred to Jesus being with Carla and telling her, her mum had died -- but we don't know. After the 9/11 attacks one woman who had lost her husband said she initially told her 5 and under children the dad was on a long trip because a) she wasn't composed enough to say anything and b) she wanted to be able to put it to them in a way they would understand, not in the heat of the moment.

What if your family were in this situation - how would you want this whole thing treated?
  #439  
Old 02-09-2007, 01:53 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lisamaria
How ridiculous blaming Letizia sounds! I always got the impression Erika didn't mind the publicity; I have definitely seen more of her than of Telma - or most members of Letizia's family. She could have been totally private very easily, and still wasn't exactly a tabloid darling.
According to obituaries that I've read and I think the article posted by Lula yesterday, she did not like being the centre of attention. So I think it is fair to say that she did mind the publicity. Moreover, large amounts of tabloid coverage does not mean that one seeks it. Since the papparazi knew where she lived and worked, it must have been pretty easy for them to tail her.

Telma works for an NGO and is away from Spain most of the time.
  #440  
Old 02-09-2007, 01:54 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Duncan
Allow me to disagree with regard to Spain. I would say that the Catholic tradition greatly prevails over the Muslim heritage, and the burial takes place after 3-4 days on average. It used to be costumary to prepare the body in order to be exposed so that friends and family could say farewell and veil it for some hours previous to burial, though in many cases this tradition isn't followed nowadays.
Duncan, there seems to be some disagreement on this tradition. I got my information from the Franco-Iberia message board where there was quite a discussion on this. Here is the link and there are quite a few more posts besides this one:

The Franco-Iberian Royals Message Board: Re: Funeral of Erika Ortiz

I'm certainly not disputing what you have to say -- there seem to be varying opinions. And I misspoke in my initial post to imply that Muslim influence is the prevailing one -- having lived in Spain I am aware of the strong Catholic influence. I only meant it was a carry over of a Muslim influence within a Catholic "structure".
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