What bothers you about Abdullah and Rania

[Alexandria]

As per our Posting Rules & Guidelines, if you are going to state one way or the other that aid money provided to Jordan is or isn't being used for personal expenditures by King Abdullah and Queen Rania, then you need to provide the evidence to back it up.

This back and forth of "it's known that this happens in these circles/countries" or "how is it known" is not evidence and simply personal feelings or musings. If that is your personal belief that the Jordanian king and queen are corrupt, then you must state it as only a personal sentiment NOT as fact.

I also do not appreciate posts by members stating "Let's get back to the thread's topic now" after they themselves have participated in derailing the thread topic. It is not considered helpful.

Alexandria
Jordanian Forum Moderator

 

[lizz70]

As per our Posting Rules & Guidelines, if you are going to state one way or the other that aid money provided to Jordan is or isn't being used for personal expenditures by King Abdullah and Queen Rania, then you need to provide the evidence to back it up.

This back and forth of "it's known that this happens in these circles/countries" or "how is it known" is not evidence and simply personal feelings or musings. If that is your personal belief that the Jordanian king and queen are corrupt, then you must state it as only a personal sentiment NOT as fact.

I also do not appreciate posts by members stating "Let's get back to the thread's topic now" after they themselves have participated in derailing the thread topic. It is not considered helpful.

Alexandria
Jordanian Forum Moderator

Yes Alexandria, I do realise that we all got sidetracked which is why I asked if we could all drop it and get back on topic.

 

[lizz70]

In addition, I was expressing a 'personal' opinion based on personal experience. Apologies to the administrators if this contravened any rules.

 

[lizz70]

I am aware that there are other users who really l;ike this couple alot but sometimes it is fun to play devil's advocate and stimulate some real debate instead of us all writing the same posts over and over about how lovely dresses/handbags/hairstyles are.

I don't mean anything bad by it

 

[Little_star]

"I am aware that there are other users who really l;ike this couple alot but sometimes it is fun to play devil's advocate and stimulate some real debate instead of us all writing the same posts over and over about how lovely dresses/handbags/hairstyles are."

Everyone's entitled to their opinions but I find it quite unsavoury that people play "devil's advocate" over something as serious as corruption.

 

[lizz70]

"I am aware that there are other users who really l;ike this couple alot but sometimes it is fun to play devil's advocate and stimulate some real debate instead of us all writing the same posts over and over about how lovely dresses/handbags/hairstyles are."

Everyone's entitled to their opinions but I find it quite unsavoury that people play "devil's advocate" over something as serious as corruption.

Corruption isn't the only thing mentioned in this thread. You are of course entitled to an opinion the same as everyone else, and, as ever, express it eloquently. I find high handedness unsavoury also. Let's just agree to disagree on certain things. I don't want World War 3.

 

[Humera]

not wanting to hear about handbags and fashion is a rather curious reason to play devil's advocate and slander someone.
The fashion debate is limited to the fashion forum where ALL the royal ladies have fashion threads devoted to them. The whole point of that forum is to have fun and engage in a light-hearted conversation about style and fashion, a topic I happen to love like many others on TRF. Many of us were grateful to finally have a separate forum devoted to the subject.
If someone doesnt like the fashion threads, they dont have to visit them.
FYI....QR was one of the last women to get her own fashion threads. Most of the princesses already had their own and even now have more fashion threads devoted to them (hats, sunglasses etc)

 

[Little_star]

"Corruption isn't the only thing mentioned in this thread."

It is one allegation that crops up regularly thoguh with absolutely no supporting evidece, I've posed my question many times before. This seemed as appropriate a thread as any to ask it.

"I don't want World War 3."
I doubt either of us has the capability.

 

[lizz70]

"Corruption isn't the only thing mentioned in this thread."

It is one allegation that crops up regularly thoguh with absolutely no supporting evidece, I've posed my question many times before. This seemed as appropriate a thread as any to ask it.
"I don't want World War 3."
I doubt either of us has the capability.

Please keep your sarcasm to yourself. I am not rising to the bait. If having the last word means so much then please, be my guest

 

[lizz70]

not wanting to hear about handbags and fashion is a rather curious reason to play devil's advocate and slander someone.
The fashion debate is limited to the fashion forum where ALL the royal ladies have fashion threads devoted to them. The whole point of that forum is to have fun and engage in a light-hearted conversation about style and fashion, a topic I happen to love like many others on TRF. Many of us were grateful to finally have a separate forum devoted to the subject.
If someone doesnt like the fashion threads, they dont have to visit them.
FYI....QR was one of the last women to get her own fashion threads. Most of the princesses already had their own and even now have more fashion threads devoted to them (hats, sunglasses etc)

Not wanting to hear about handbags is not the reason, the reason is that although there are plenty of threads as you rightly point out, for fashion etc not only for QR but other royal ladies, there are very few places that other shades of opinion may be heard. Just as there are threads outlining reasons why members are annoyed/don't like/ whatever such and such royal personages, there was none for QR and KA. I believe that if you go to the start of the thread, Citizen005 said that he/she set up the thread in the interests of fairness and balance and to allow some healthy debate. We all are aware of who the really big JFR fans are here and good for them, but sometimes it nice for others who are not such huge fans to have a place to express an opinion too.

Personally, I don't hate either QR or KA, I don't agree with everything they do and like I said, the topic got sidetracked.

 

[ZZZ]

Im beggining to understand this now. Extravagance, no matter how tacky and shalow, is fine as long as its done by a wealthy person behind the prying eyes of the camera. How wonderful.

I prefer Rania's way. At least its honest. Her life is open for everyone to see.
She's not trying to appease the so-called critics by covering herself head to toe in public while indulging herself behind the palace doors.

Trying to rationalize the 2 lifestyles into the same category is time consuming. they are both different. it is not that they do it behind closed doors, hidden from the world. their people know them and know their lifestyles. just because they don't invite the worlds media to document their latest extravegance or jet set destination, does not mean they are hiding.

if you have an issue with women who cover, whilst being able to indulge in their OWN wealth, well, that is your issue. people are well aware of the princess's and sheikha's lifestyles and are comfortable with them leading those lifestyles, because they themselves are able to live comfortable and secure lifestyles..... in countries that provide for them and their families.

that is quite an exaggeration!
It was a private and intimate party with no where near as many guests as Hamzah's wedding.

Intimate is a few friends in a small setting.... not a tent, filled with people and royals dancing the night away. and like i said, hamza's wedding was justifiable. maybe you should finish my quote "remember the birthday party they had for prince feisal - it was nearly as elaborate as prince hamza's wedding (which is fine, seeing that is the wedding of a crown prince)" instead ofmaking sound like a shallow person.

 

[Little_star]

"their people know them and know their lifestyles. just because they don't invite the worlds media to document their latest extravegance or jet set destination, does not mean they are hiding."

Somehow I doubt the average Saudi or UAE citizen is aware of just how extravagant the lifestyles their Royals lead are. And extravagance is just the tip of the iceberg.

"Intimate is a few friends in a small setting.... not a tent, filled with people and royals dancing the night away"
Feisal is a Royal, so who else would you expect at hs birthday party?!

 

[Little_star]

"Please keep your sarcasm to yourself. I am not rising to the bait"

I wasn't actually being sarcastic, but never mind.

 

[lizz70]

"Please keep your sarcasm to yourself. I am not rising to the bait"

I wasn't actually being sarcastic, but never mind.

OK Little Star, it just came over that way. No hard feelings.

 

[ZZZ]

"their people know them and know their lifestyles. just because they don't invite the worlds media to document their latest extravegance or jet set destination, does not mean they are hiding."

Somehow I doubt the average Saudi or UAE citizen is aware of just how extravagant the lifestyles their Royals lead are. And extravagance is just the tip of the iceberg.

"Intimate is a few friends in a small setting.... not a tent, filled with people and royals dancing the night away"
Feisal is a Royal, so who else would you expect at hs birthday party?!

obviousley not all their people, but we are talking about the majority, not the minority. have you been on the inside track of the Gulf royals extravegances?? have you witnessed their genorisity? have you seen what the UAE goverment provides for their citizens.... free housing, free land, free schooling, free university, free health care.....

i know he is a royal but i was replying to the word intimate. not doubting his roots.

 

[Humera]

hamzah's wedding had hundreds of guests while Feisal's birthday had family members and a few foreign royals. I have all the pictures.
You stay comfortable with your extravagant sheikhs and let Feisal have his birthday. He has the freedom to live his life and doesnt need to justify his birthday party or anything else to you. Objecting to every single activity, whether personal or public, of not just the King and Queen but the extended family is going pretty far. And all of this under the excuse that they're not living on oil money. Apparently people in poorer nations dont have big birthday parties, dont shop, dont have vacations, dont live a normal, enjoyable life, period.

 

[Little_star]

"have you been on the inside track of the Gulf royals extravegances??"

The Gulf no, the Saudis yes. My uncle worked in Saudi Arabia for many years. Firstly in a hospital/clinic (can't remember which) in Riyadh and then one of the Princes hired him as a private physician for his family. The stories he recounted are shocking, in ever sense of the word.

"have you seen what the UAE goverment provides for their citizens.... free housing, free land, free schooling, free university, free health care....."

It's a shame they don't treat these people with quite the same amount of respect then:
http://www.dailytimes.com.pk/default.asp?page=story_11-4-2005_pg7_48

"i know he is a royal but i was replying to the word intimate. not doubting his roots."
I realise that, but what I meant was that as he himself is Royal, there are bound to be plenty of Royals at his birthday.

 

[Humera]

have you witnessed their genorisity?

oh yes we've seen that generosity. we saw it during the tsunami. Apparently the rest of the world didn't seem to think they were so generous. The newspapers were full of it. Where are the oil-rich Muslim nations? Why aren't they helping their brethren?
But I forget, this so-called generosity is for their own people. Everyone else they look down upon.
Step outside the Gulf and you wont find many who think the gulf royals "generous"

 

[ZZZ]

hamzah's wedding had hundreds of guests while Feisal's birthday had family members and a few foreign royals. I have all the pictures.
You stay comfortable with your extravagant sheikhs and let Feisal have his birthday. He has the freedom to live his life and doesnt need to justify his birthday party or anything else to you. Objecting to every single activity, whether personal or public, of not just the King and Queen but the extended family is going pretty far. And all of this under the excuse that they're not living on oil money. Apparently people in poorer nations dont have big birthday parties, dont shop, dont have vacations, dont live a normal, enjoyable life, period.

enjoy all the pictures - maybe they can justify all your excuses for their excuses.

as for me picking on everything, i am merely stating the obvious. the forum is about what bothers people about them, and this is what bothers me about them, their extravegance when their people are dying. poor nations are allowed to do as they please, as are richer nations.... same way, i am allowed to voice my opinions about the way they lead their life, in their choice of publicizing every part of it.

 

[lizz70]

"have you been on the inside track of the Gulf royals extravegances??"

The Gulf no, the Saudis yes. My uncle worked in Saudi Arabia for many years. Firstly in a hospital/clinic (can't remember which) in Riyadh and then one of the Princes hired him as a private physician for his family. The stories he recounted are shocking, in ever sense of the word.

"have you seen what the UAE goverment provides for their citizens.... free housing, free land, free schooling, free university, free health care....."

It's a shame they don't treat these people with quite the same amount of respect then:
http://www.dailytimes.com.pk/default.asp?page=story_11-4-2005_pg7_48

"i know he is a royal but i was replying to the word intimate. not doubting his roots."
I realise that, but what I meant was that as he himself is Royal, there are bound to be plenty of Royals at his birthday.

The Emirates provides for Emirati's only. I agree with you about the poverty of the migrant workers in the Gulf. I lived in UAE, Yemen and Saudi - also Jordan. However, there is an awful lot of poverty and discrimination experienced by those of Palestinian origins in Jordan too. It seems like every country has a group of people at the very edge of society who suffers.

 

[ZZZ]

"have you been on the inside track of the Gulf royals extravegances??"

The Gulf no, the Saudis yes. My uncle worked in Saudi Arabia for many years. Firstly in a hospital/clinic (can't remember which) in Riyadh and then one of the Princes hired him as a private physician for his family. The stories he recounted are shocking, in ever sense of the word.

"have you seen what the UAE goverment provides for their citizens.... free housing, free land, free schooling, free university, free health care....."

It's a shame they don't treat these people with quite the same amount of respect then:
http://www.dailytimes.com.pk/default.asp?page=story_11-4-2005_pg7_48

"i know he is a royal but i was replying to the word intimate. not doubting his roots."
I realise that, but what I meant was that as he himself is Royal, there are bound to be plenty of Royals at his birthday.

i said their people. not expats.

 

[lizz70]

i said their people. not expats.

That is what I meant too ZZZ I do think credit is due to the UAE for the social policies they have for their people.

 

[Humera]

as for me picking on everything, i am merely stating the obvious. the forum is about what bothers people about them, and this is what bothers me about them, their extravegance when their people are dying. poor nations are allowed to do as they please, as are richer nations.... same way, i am allowed to voice my opinions about the way they lead their life, in their choice of publicizing every part of it.

one slight problem. this thread isnt about what bothers you about Prince Feisal or the Jordanian royal family.
But I suppose that the fact that KA and QR were present at the event was motive enough for you.
There's no need for exaggeration. You say "their people are dying" as if they'd been inflicted with the Black Death. They have a lot of poor people yes, but thats different.

 

[ZZZ]

oh yes we've seen that generosity. we saw it during the tsunami. Apparently the rest of the world didn't seem to think they were so generous. The newspapers were full of it. Where are the oil-rich Muslim nations? Why aren't they helping their brethren?
But I forget, this so-called generosity is for their own people. Everyone else they look down upon.
Step outside the Gulf and you wont find many who think the gulf royals "generous"

they gave more than than most countries. they focus on their people, because their people come before others, even before other arabs. a leaders duty is to his people and his country, first and foremost.

 

[lizz70]

OK, I am going to say that another thing thaqt bothers me about KA and QR (not just them but other 'charity' celebs) is this going round picking up medals and honours for doing charity work. Isn't it better to be modest when doing charity work, not to publicise your own role too much and not to accept accolades when there are people who do all the 'dirty' work and never get any recognition?

 

[ZZZ]

one slight problem. this thread isnt about what bothers you about Prince Feisal or the Jordanian royal family.
But I suppose that the fact that KA and QR were present at the event was motive enough for you.
There's no need for exaggeration. You say "their people are dying" as if they'd been inflicted with the Black Death. They have a lot of poor people yes, but thats different.

do you think, not being able to provide a home for your child, food for your family or a having a job to secure one's family is not considered dying.

 

[Humera]

what a wonderful justification.
Hats off to the western nations though who look after their citizens and still have compassion for others.

 

[Humera]

do you think, not being able to provide a home for your child, food for your family or a having a job to secure one's family is not considered dying.

I seem to have this crazy notion that dying means death, literally.
People all over Africa are dying, of starvation. Thats called dying.

 

[ZZZ]

what a wonderful justification.
Hats off to the western nations though who look after their citizens and still have compassion for others.

lets see, when the earthquake hit pakistan, the gulf countries were the first to respond. the UAE alone sent a military field hospital for over 2months and took critical patients to the UAE. I recall england sending 9 rescuers, so why not, hatts off to the 9 rescuers and lets ignore a whole working field hospital.

take care of their citizens how, by making them pay their royals a percantage of their income, in order to supplement their lifestyles?? or by making them pay taxes?

 

[lizz70]

I seem to have this crazy notion that dying means death, literally.
People all over Africa are dying, of starvation. Thats called dying.

I might be wrong here but I think, what ZZZ means is that although it may not be 'dying' in the literal sense - It most certainly can't be called 'living'.