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  #181  
Old 06-27-2004, 05:25 PM
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Quote:
Originally posted by Genevieve@Jun 27th, 2004 - 8:05 am
I did not think that Rania was prepared to work as hard as Noor did in her role and having Noor go about her normal life in Jordan while Rania did barely nothing would've been a negative reminder to the Jordanian people and cast a bad shadow on Rania.
Well, this is interesting. So you think QR doesn't have quite the work ethic of QN and needed to send her far, far away so it wouldn't be a point of stark comparison between them?
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  #182  
Old 06-27-2004, 05:28 PM
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That's true - KA is always asking for money.. it's called investments, but it's more charity... Mo's powerful and as his wife - Haya's come into her own.... still, polygamy ... I have a question... everytime I see KA or QR at an event - it's usually promoted as 'under the patronage' of either one - or 'under the directives' or thanks to the 'initiative of' them.. what exactly does that mean? I mean if the money comes from elsewhere - shouldn't the donor get the credit?
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  #183  
Old 06-27-2004, 05:41 PM
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When Q Noor first became Queen, she lived in the shadow of the much Loved Q Alia.. she was resented in a sense and it took her time to find her own footing.. but she didn't do that by trying to downplay Q Alia's accomplishments and contributions.. I think that she had to work for whatever credit and respect she got. For Rania to chase Noor out of the Country and to take credit for organizations Noor started - as though Noor really didn't exist... :o
Whether or not Rania has the same work ethic.. well, a lot of the local things Q Alia and Q Noor had done seemed to me at least - to be done without any expectations or courtship of the media.. everytime QRania does something - immediately it's broadcasted all over the place.. I wonder if she'd still do them if it was on the down low and not more media attention...
About the wedding - I understand KA and QR are the monarchs in Jordan, but they are not the parents of CP Hamzah or CP Noor.. and to in an essence attempt to upstage the Mother of the groom - his only living parent - just to be the center of attention themselves - is just not right..
  #184  
Old 06-27-2004, 05:48 PM
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Isnt the Jerash festival coming up in July? I wonder if Rania will miss it. I hope Princess Noor shows up though.
  #185  
Old 06-27-2004, 06:14 PM
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Quote:
Originally posted by QueenB@Jun 27th, 2004 - 3:41 pm
When Q Noor first became Queen, she lived in the shadow of the much Loved Q Alia.. she was resented in a sense and it took her time to find her own footing.. but she didn't do that by trying to downplay Q Alia's accomplishments and contributions.. I think that she had to work for whatever credit and respect she got. For Rania to chase Noor out of the Country and to take credit for organizations Noor started - as though Noor really didn't exist... :o
Whether or not Rania has the same work ethic.. well, a lot of the local things Q Alia and Q Noor had done seemed to me at least - to be done without any expectations or courtship of the media.. everytime QRania does something - immediately it's broadcasted all over the place.. I wonder if she'd still do them if it was on the down low and not more media attention...
About the wedding - I understand KA and QR are the monarchs in Jordan, but they are not the parents of CP Hamzah or CP Noor.. and to in an essence attempt to upstage the Mother of the groom - his only living parent - just to be the center of attention themselves - is just not right..
Agree with you completely, QueenB. Although Jordan is a small country, there are certainly enough problems for two queens to address. Like you, I don't see why QR had to effectively take over QN's initiatives. People, for the most part, can be quite reasonable and understanding. If QR wanted to take some time to find her own way after being suddenly cast in her new role, I think they would've given her a grace period during which she could find her feet. Stealing QN's projects, to me, doesn't show much intelligence on QR's part. I think it would've been far wiser of her to work with QN, learn all the lessons QN learned in her 20+ years in the role, figure out which issues are really her own passions, and become partners rather than adversaries. Together, they could be so much more powerful than either of them alone.

Also agree with you that QR seeks the limelight more than her predecessors. It's enough to make me wonder whether that is her motive for being involved in projects in the first place. Personally, I find it "beneath" a queen to appear on "Oprah" and in fashion magazines, and it undermines her, in my opinion.

KA and QR should be ashamed of themselves for how they conducted themselves at CP Hamzah's wedding vis-a-vis QN. Not just at the wedding itself, but all the pre-ceremony planning and scheming that must've gone into ensuring QN wouldn't get to shine on that day.
  #186  
Old 06-27-2004, 06:18 PM
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Quote:
Originally posted by ~*~Humera~*~@Jun 27th, 2004 - 3:48 pm
Isnt the Jerash festival coming up in July? I wonder if Rania will miss it. I hope Princess Noor shows up though.
Last year, both KA and QR attended the opening ceremonies. QN wasn't there, even though she was in the country then and helped plan it.
  #187  
Old 06-27-2004, 06:20 PM
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Quote:
Originally posted by QueenB@Jun 27th, 2004 - 4:41 pm
When Q Noor first became Queen, she lived in the shadow of the much Loved Q Alia.. she was resented in a sense and it took her time to find her own footing.. but she didn't do that by trying to downplay Q Alia's accomplishments and contributions.. I think that she had to work for whatever credit and respect she got. For Rania to chase Noor out of the Country and to take credit for organizations Noor started - as though Noor really didn't exist... :o
Whether or not Rania has the same work ethic.. well, a lot of the local things Q Alia and Q Noor had done seemed to me at least - to be done without any expectations or courtship of the media.. everytime QRania does something - immediately it's broadcasted all over the place.. I wonder if she'd still do them if it was on the down low and not more media attention...
About the wedding - I understand KA and QR are the monarchs in Jordan, but they are not the parents of CP Hamzah or CP Noor.. and to in an essence attempt to upstage the Mother of the groom - his only living parent - just to be the center of attention themselves - is just not right..
QueenB,

I too agree with your last statement. It did seem as though KA and QR were upstaging the mother of the bridegroom at the wedding. I understand that they are the monarchs, but the bridegroom's as well as the bride's parents seemed to be in the shadows it this wedding; they just did not seem apart of the happiness. And it appeared to me as if KA and QR were photographed as much if not more than the newly wedded couple. I personal did not know what to think about the wedding after viewing the pictures. After awhile, I just moved on. I really didn't care for this wedding. I did not see the joy and warmth I expect at this relatively small wedding in comparsion to the other weddings of that month. I sensed that Prince Hamzah was to composed. I did not see what appeared to me a relaxed shot........wait the wedding cake shot ,but it still appeared to me that Prince Hamzah was consisently saying to himself don't smile keep it serious. I know that they reason he wanted a small wedding was because of the situation in the Middle East, but he could have loosened up alittle.

And lastly, I did not respect the way he did not stand up for his mother. I am sure he is aware of the heartache his mother has endured at the hands of KA and QR, especially QR. He should have made sure that his mother was at his side during this important day. There should be no other women in his life more important ,other than his wife, than his mother. I only hope he looks back on this in a couple of years and shame himself. He did an injustice to mother on what was to be one of the most important days of his life.
  #188  
Old 06-27-2004, 06:43 PM
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papillon, I totally agree that if they worked together - it would have been a winning situation for all, especially Jordan.. Instead it's made her look somewhat petty - and I think, because of how QN is handling it - particularly by not giving interviews complaining about it or by handling herself with grace under pressure in situations such as the wedding of the CP - it made her look dignified.
I remember reading some comment - when asked about her spending habits - that she responded by saying she didn't even have a tiara yet.. :o that just - in my opinion showed where her mind was...
I do think she's trying to handle her own image as Hollywood studios once handled their stars - by creating an image and carefully exploiting it through all publicity forums to make her famous.. while it's true that such publicity makes Jordan more famous - it is also true that a Nation needs its leaders to be more in touch with it's people than trying to become the most famous of all royals.. I think she's really trying to be famous worldwide and that explains the fashion magazines and Oprah..
I've always wondered about the comment KA made about that it was up to Hamzah not to make the same mistakes as Hassan.. was that just a comment or a warning to Hamzah not to step out of line - in particular taking Noor's side in whatever 'issues' arise between KA, QR and QN? He's at this point between a rock and a hard place - if he blows being CP then all that's happened has been for what - but allowing his Mother to be disrespected and treated badly, may be something she has asked him to swallow his pride on... he obviously wants to be King - his marriage surely may be love - but who can deny it's clear political placement within Jordan - a Jordanian born Queen is better positioned than a foreign born Palestinian Queen....
Which makes me wonder..... if KH wanted Hamzah to be King - could he have asked Abdullah to be King until Hamzah was 'old enough' and ready to take the throne - or is Abdullah in it for the long haul?
Hamzah's naturally reserved.. he's really shy - that may be why he had that constipated, stiff look in some of the pictures.. - no disrespect intended of course..
  #189  
Old 06-27-2004, 07:20 PM
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Quote:
Originally posted by QueenB@Jun 27th, 2004 - 4:43 pm
I do think she's trying to handle her own image as Hollywood studios once handled their stars - by creating an image and carefully exploiting it through all publicity forums to make her famous.. while it's true that such publicity makes Jordan more famous - it is also true that a Nation needs its leaders to be more in touch with it's people than trying to become the most famous of all royals.. I think she's really trying to be famous worldwide and that explains the fashion magazines and Oprah..

I've always wondered about the comment KA made about that it was up to Hamzah not to make the same mistakes as Hassan.. was that just a comment or a warning to Hamzah not to step out of line - in particular taking Noor's side in whatever 'issues' arise between KA, QR and QN? He's at this point between a rock and a hard place - if he blows being CP then all that's happened has been for what - but allowing his Mother to be disrespected and treated badly
Agree with you again, QueenB. We are simpatico on this!

But, with QR's need for fame, famous for what? For being beautiful? For wearing haute couture? She would be famous anyway, just for being a queen. But she could be not only famous, but also more respected by using her position to TRULY help those in dire need, not just superficially launching so many projects that no mere mortal could ever possibly see them all through effectively. I think she is playing the hand she was dealt very poorly, but I hope as she matures she evolves. QN made a lot of missteps early on, but she managed to correct course a bit as she grew into the role.

It seems pretty clear to me that KA's comment was a scarcely veiled threat to CP Hamzah. CP Hamzah is still pretty young, even though he's trying to fashion himself as a mature adult. It must be a difficult position for him to be in. Call me a hard case, but I think there must be a middle road for him to choose--not just either you're with the King or you're with your own mother. I can't see any mother authorizing her son to show her disrespect in the interest of career climbing. But maybe CP Hamzah could position himself and his relationship with his mother to KA as one that's in the best interests of the country and the image of the royal family to maintain properly. KA, QR, and CP Hamzah all look pretty bad to me in this particular light. I'm sure others have noticed, too. Still, if KA is giving CP Hamzah an ultimatum on this, I think the latter has made the wrong choice and has sold his soul to the devil.
  #190  
Old 06-27-2004, 08:30 PM
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I totally agree with you!

It's funny though.. because whenever QR's beauty is mentioned right away it is also mentioned that QN is a beauty in her own right (although poor woman has absolutely no fashion sense)... I don't think Rania appreciates that.. as far as Queens go Rania is gorgeous - but to make that the sole 'qualification' as to why she's to be respected is outright ridiculous... she does take on a lot of charitable organizations - but as usual if publicized... I remember Princess Haya saying that Q Alia didn't believe in getting publicity as Queen, that she did charity work and did what she could to help people.. but she was much more interested in being behind the scenes... I think that she would have been famous for being Queen too - but she wants to be a glam figure.. she says she wants to draw attention to Jordan..
I think KA and QR want to be seen as 'modern' that's why there's always the talk of their 'equality and partnership'.....

I agree that CP Hamzah should stick up for his Mom.... I think Noor wants to see him be king and if means swallowing her pride - I think she's willing to... also, no matter what - I think KA does hope to see his own son succeed him..... once while on a newsprogram - there was a clip shown from the 1960's of KH, talking about the Israeli Palestinian issues and when the clip was done, KA said, something like we are still talking about the same issue, it's like my son sitting here in a few years talking about the same thing... so that's surely on Hamzah's mind...
Also, these days Princess Muna's all over the place as the mother of the king.... so perhaps with Noor being around would have not been welcomed by her...

papillon, did you ever hear the rumors on the investigation of QNoor's finances by KA and QR? I'd heard about it - but not too much detail....
  #191  
Old 06-27-2004, 08:45 PM
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QRania hasn't been in public for more than a month, I wonder what is keeping her that busy!!
  #192  
Old 06-27-2004, 08:50 PM
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Quote:
Originally posted by QueenB@Jun 27th, 2004 - 6:30 pm
Once while on a newsprogram - there was a clip shown from the 1960's of KH, talking about the Israeli Palestinian issues and when the clip was done, KA said, something like we are still talking about the same issue, it's like my son sitting here in a few years talking about the same thing.

papillon, did you ever hear the rumors on the investigation of QNoor's finances by KA and QR? I'd heard about it - but not too much detail....
Well, that's quite a slip up KA had! He's as much as confessing that CP Hamzah is just a placeholder. No wonder CP Hamzah is planning to attend graduate school. He's got no job security.

Yes, I did read something about KA and QR investigating QN's finances. If I recall correctly, it was a gossip column item in the US newspapers from about a year ago where someone at a restaurant overheard QN complaining to friends about it. If it's true, obviously, four or five years after his death, KH's asset distribution is still being questioned. Rather sad.
  #193  
Old 06-27-2004, 09:07 PM
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QueenB and papillon you both have a following in me! I wholeheartedly agree with many of the statements the two of you have made in this thread about Queen Noor, Queen Rania and their "rivalry." The two of you have already covered how I personally view the situation very well, but some additional thoughts.

I see Queen Rania as essentially a very vain individual. I feel badly for her that she was not prepared for the role of Queen as other Crown Princesses are, and that she was thrust into this role. A very short amount of time went by between King Hussein changing the sucession rights and his unfortunate passing. I'm sure that in the beginning it was quite an adjustment for Queen Rania to go from a mere princess to the Queen of Jordan, and further compounding all the adjustments she had to make with this new role, tremendous political tension in the ME which no doubt put a strain on the new King who probably looked to his wife for much support. I would not want to seem cold hearted and that I had no sympathy for Rania at this time, because truly I do. What a mind boggling situation to find yourself in.

But on the other hand, in the ensuing years, and I presume that in the 5 or so years since King Hussein's passing Rania has been able to adjust to her "new" role, I have not seen any improvement on Rania's part in her role as Queen of Jordan. Increasingly, whenever I see press coverage of her she is the epitome of a jet-setting socialite. She has hairdressers from Los Angeles flown in to do her hair for state visits, she dresses in extremely expensive designer clothes and accessories, attends numerous parties that to me have no association in helping Jordan or its people (yes, she could be networking but when she's at a Bulgari party, I think she's there more for herself than for the people of Jordan), or she is frequently on vacation.

And while I know that she cannot control what the press writes about when she agrees to sit down to do an interview with them, I wonder this: Writer after writer ineveitably ends up writing a piece that is 95% about Queen Rania's looks and what she is wearing. To me that implies that not much else interesting was said during the course of the interview and that since the writer has to produce a piece about Queen Rania, focusing on her physical qualities are the best and only thing they can do.

I myself find Queen Noor to be quite attractive, and not just "in her own right." And when you read stories about Queen Noor, years before her husband died, in the time immediately following it and now, maybe a paragraph at most is commented on Noor's physical qualities, her clothes and that she is American-born. The rest of the story focuses on her humanitarian efforts, her work with landmines, etc. I have also seen TV interviews with Noor while she was still Queen and King Hussein was still alive and what did she do on this interview? She took the journalist around Jordan to show her the kind of work she was doing in the country, including taking her to meet several women who had started small businesses because of a program Noor had started. She took the journalist to a small daycare swap centre where women from this very same program took care of each other's children once or twice a week so that they could go and work without having to worry about also caring for their children. There was also footage of Noor on a Red Cross anti-landmines mission, meeting with landmine victims, touring areas filled with landmines, etc.

I know I've been long winded about this, but my point is that as much as writers and journalists will write and show on TV what they want of an interview with Rania, she also has some control in that she can give them more to discuss about her than her neweset Fendi bag and Chanel suit. She could take them around Jordan and show them what she has done to help improve the lives of Jordanians, what organizations she is working with, etc. But I think Rania cannot do this as Noor did because Rania is not this active in Jordan.

Of course each queen brings her own ideas of how to go about the job, and each queen does it differently than her predecessor. But I think the values and commitment of Queen Rania and Queen Noor are vastly different, and not in a good way. Queen Rania shouldn't do exactly as Queen Noor did, I am not saying that, but what she is doing (floating around in designer wears and jet setting from one glamourous event to another) is not exactly the definition of a good queen either. Had she not tried to push Queen Noor out of the country so quickly she might've learned a thing or two from Queen Noor on what the role of Queen of Jordan entails, not just what the money from it can buy you.
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  #194  
Old 06-28-2004, 12:57 AM
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Quote:
Originally posted by Genevieve@Jun 27th, 2004 - 7:07 pm
Writer after writer ineveitably ends up writing a piece that is 95% about Queen Rania's looks and what she is wearing.
That is so true! I remember making the exact comment in one of the threads a couple of months ago. The western media especially adores Rania. They love to gobble up anyone who's thin, beautiful, glamorous, and wealthy, Rania fits all the categories. Plus, they also love to draw on the comparison between her and the stereotypical arab/muslim woman. But in the end, their emphasis on Rania's looks only serves to add to her obsession/insecurities about her appearance. Seems to me that she dresses more to please/shock the media more than anything else. Take the dress she wore to Prince Felipe's pre-wedding gala. I bet she knew it would raise eyebrows in the middle east and draw a lot of attention from the photographers.

As for all her vacations and hobnobbing with fashion designers, it is all somewhat excessive. Yes she does deserve some time off from all the official duties she performs but sometimes her lifestyle reminds me of wealthy socialites who have nothing better to do with their time or money. Although many royal women do attend fashion shows/parties, they often come from prosperous, democratic countries that do not suffer all the problems that a poor country like Jordan does.
Besides, if you want to raise your country's profile, you talk to politicians and diplomats, not celebrities.
  #195  
Old 06-28-2004, 01:11 AM
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Quote:
Originally posted by papillon@Jun 27th, 2004 - 4:18 pm
Last year, both KA and QR attended the opening ceremonies.  QN wasn't there, even though she was in the country then and helped plan it.
Wow I didnt know that. I feel so sorry for queen Noor. But then again, maybe she chose not to attend. God cant the members of this family attend an event and not have it turn into an issue about status and precedence?
  #196  
Old 06-28-2004, 05:20 AM
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hi, we descussess about what what happen between , q.rania and p.haya .. not k.abdullah , from where get the money , this another topic,ll maybe descusess about hem someday ... right or not
  #197  
Old 06-28-2004, 07:55 PM
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It was in response to the previous two posts about Haya's position
  #198  
Old 06-28-2004, 07:59 PM
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Looks like Q. Rania is back in action:

http://www.petra.gov.jo/nepras/2004/Jun/28/I153700.htm
http://www.petra.gov.jo/nepras/2004/Jun/28/I153800.htm
http://www.petra.gov.jo/nepras/2004/Jun/28/I153900.htm

She definitely looks as if she's recovering from an illness. She looks pallid and thinner.
  #199  
Old 06-28-2004, 10:20 PM
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noonj-i think it fairly obvious that many of us are quite startled that you would say QR & PH don't get along. i know i was under the impression that they were friendly.

could you please eloborate on why you think there is a rift between the two?

many thanks!
  #200  
Old 06-28-2004, 10:50 PM
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Did you notice that she's also wearing three layers on top? I wonder if she's hiding a bigger belly.
She does look paler though.
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